1 100 7 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/fce724952773f51471717fce7ed72c54.pdf 0fd076b6610ed90aeadf407cf5e14674 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Orlando Gay Chorus Collection Alternative Title Gay Chorus Collection Is Part Of Orlando Gay Chorus Collection, RICHES Program Type Collection Digital Collection <div class="element-text"><a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/">RICHES MI</a></div> <div class="element-text"> </div> Subject Orlando (Fla.) Music--Florida Dance--United States Gay culture--United States Description The Orlando Gay Chorus (OGC) is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit arts and humanitarian organization, and part of the Gay and Lesbian Association (GALA) of Choruses. Founded on Valentines Day 1990, OGC is not only one of the largest mixed gay choirs in the United States at over 100 members, but they also boast four smaller ensembles that perform annual concerts, cabarets, and a host of community events, such as Come Out With Pride, Orlando Museum of Art’s Festival of Trees, and World AIDS Day memorial services. In 2017, the group performed at over 105 events, including 15 performances for the first anniversary of the Pulse Nightclub tragedy. Members come from all walks of life and all sexual and gender orientations, including straight allies. OGC lives by the motto “Singing the World to a Better Place” and strives to use music to change attitudes and build a stronger community. Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Oral History of Richard Lamberty Alternative Title Oral History, Richard Lamberty Subject Orlando (Fla.) Music--Florida Mass shootings Dance--United States Gay culture--United States Description An oral history interview of Richard Lamberty, a member of the Orlando Gay Chorus, same-sex ballroom dancer, and software developer. This interview was conducted by Geoffrey Cravero at the Center for Humanities and Digital Research at the University of Central Florida (UCF) in Orlando, Florida, on October 11th, 2016. Some of the topics covered include a biographical summary, his educational history, discovering dance, his family history, his relationship with his father, same-sex ballroom dancing, the Orlando Gay Chorus, Orlando Cloggers, becoming a dance instructor, losing communication and physical skills from rheumatoid arthritis, world travels as a dance instructor, homosexuality in Japan, the end of his dance career, North American Same-Sex Partner Dance Association (NASSPDA), the history of same-sex dancing, the kinesiology of dance, Dance Vision International Dancers Association (DVIDA) American Smooth Bronze Syllabus manual, reasons for joining the Orlando Gay Chorus, the mass shooting at the Pulse nightclub and its aftermath, the Gay and Lesbian Association of Choruses (GALA) Festival, being a public figure and representing Orlando, violence against homosexuals, meeting a transsexual Muslim, the John F. Kennedy Space Center (KSC) vigil for victims of the Pulse massacre, homosexuality in the space and defense industry, turning tragedy into positive change, gun control reform, the community response to Pulse tragedy, the significance of the rainbow flag, the long-term consequences of the Pulse tragedy, and the rise of fundamentalism. Table Of Contents 0:00:00 Introduction 0:03:06 Family 0:07:24 Same-sex dancing and the Orlando Gay Chorus 0:11:06 Living with rheumatoid arthritis 0:13:43 Changing attitudes towards homosexuality in Japan 0:18:05 History of same-sex dancing 0:25:04 Dance Vision International Dancers Association (DVIDA) and the kinesiology of dance 0:30:13 Joining the Orlando Gay Chorus 0:36:00 Mass shooting at Pulse nightclub 0:48:08 Achievements in computer science 0:50:36 2016 GALA Choruses Festival and abuse against the LGTBQ+ community 1:01:01 Singing at John F. Kennedy Space Center and gun control 1:06:37 Community response to Pulse tragedy 1:09:11 How the Orlando Gay Chorus can influence political and social change 1:17:07 Closing remarks Abstract Oral history interview of Richard Lamberty. Interview conducted by Geoffrey Cravero in Orlando, Florida, on October 11, 2016. Type Moving Image Source Lamberty, Richard. Interviewed by Geoffrey Cravero, October 11, 2016. Audio record available. <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>, Orlando, Florida. Requires Multimedia software, such as <a href="http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/" target="_blank"> QuickTime</a>. <a href="http://www.adobe.com/products/reader.html" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a> Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/collections/show/206" target="_blank">Orlando Gay Chorus Collection</a>, LGBTQ+ Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Has Format Digital transcript of original 1-hour, 18-minute, and 03-second oral history: Lamberty, Richard. Interviewed by Geoffrey Cravero. Audio record available. <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>, Orlando, Florida. Coverage Dr. Phillips Center for the Performing Arts, Orlando, Florida GALA Choruses Festival, Denver Performing Arts Center, Denver, Colorado Japan Orlando, Florida Pulse, Orlando, Florida Rollins College, Winter Park, Florida University of Central Florida, Orlando, Florida Creator Lamberty, Richard Cravero, Geoffrey Publisher <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> Date Created 2016-10-11 Date Copyrighted 2016-10-11 Format video/mp4 application/pdf Extent 1.09 GB 283 KB Medium 1-hour, 18-minute and 4-second video recording Language eng Mediator History Teacher Humanities Teacher Music Teacher Dance Teacher Provenance Originally created by Richard Lamberty and Geoffrey Cravero and published by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>. Rights Holder <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> Accrual Method Item Creation Curator Cravero, Geoffrey Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> External Reference Katalin, Lnyi. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/951006947" target="_blank">Same-Sex Ballroom Dance - A Challenge to Patriarchal Gender Order</a>. VDM Verlag, 2008. PeRez, Robert. "<a href="http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2005-12-27/news/DANCER27_1_dance-instructors-professional-dancer-same-sex-dancing" target="_blank">Orlando native overcomes odds, rules dance floor</a>." Orlando Sentinel, December 27, 2005. Accessed November 7, 2016. http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2005-12-27/news/DANCER27_1_dance-instructors-professional-dancer-same-sex-dancing. Shepherd, Lindy T. "<a href="http://www.orlandoweekly.com/orlando/who-leads/Content?oid=2253395#" target="_blank">WHO LEADS?</a>." Orlando Weekly, March 30, 2006. Accessed November 7, 2016. http://www.orlandoweekly.com/orlando/who-leads/Content?oid=2253395#. Ahlquist, Karen. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/62281651" target="_blank">Chorus and Community</a>. Urbana: University of Illinois Press, 2006. Boedeker, Hal. "<a href="http://www.orlandosentinel.com/features/os-orlando-gay-chorus-25-years-20150611-story.html" target="_blank">Orlando Gay Chorus marks 25 years</a>." Orlando Sentinel, October 18, 2016. Accessed October 18, 2016. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/features/os-orlando-gay-chorus-25-years-20150611-story.html. Ogles, Jacob. "<a href="http://www.advocate.com/pride/2016/10/06/pride-orlando-will-take-new-meaning" target="_blank">Pride in Orlando Will Take on New Meaning</a>." The Advocate, October 6, 2016. Accessed October 18, 2016. http://www.advocate.com/pride/2016/10/06/pride-orlando-will-take-new-meaning. Hyman, Jamie. "<a href="http://www.watermarkonline.com/2016/06/16/community-rises-mass-shooting-orlando-gay-nightclub-kills-49/" target="_blank">Community rises up after mass shooting at Orlando gay nightclub kills 49</a>." Watermark, June 16, 2016. Accessed October 18, 2016. http://www.watermarkonline.com/2016/06/16/community-rises-mass-shooting-orlando-gay-nightclub-kills-49/. Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website) <a href="https://youtu.be/K2rphgLl1sQ" target="_blank">Oral History of Richard Lamberty</a> Transcript Cravero Alright. Let’s see. This is Geoffrey Cravero, and I’m conducting an oral history with Richard Lamberty of the Orlando Gay Chorus. The interview is being conducted in the conference room of the Center fo—of—Center for [laughs] Humanities and Digital Research at the University of Central Florida in Orlando, Florida, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2016 [clears throat]. Lamberty Which, by the way, happens to be National Coming Out Day. Cravero National Coming Out Day. I saw the s—I saw the sign earlier. Excellent, good timing. So, uh, Mr. Lamberty, thank you for speaking with us today. If you would, let’s start by having you state your name and telling us a little about where you’re from. Lamberty Richard Lamberty. L-A-M-B—as in boy—E-R-T-Y. Um, I was born in Chicago, Illinois, and we moved to Orlando when I was five. Um, we stayed here until I was 16, and then we briefly moved to Maryland, where I graduated high school, and then I came back to Orlando and attended Rollins [College], um, and then after Rollins, I actually came to UCF[1] for almost two years, during which time I was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis and they put me on a medication. Um, one of the side effects of that medication was I lost the ability to read, write, and speak, and so I was unable to complete my graduate degree at that time, um—ended[sic] up moving to New Mexico, where my parents had gone, and enrolled in the university out there to, uh, work in their computer science artificial intelligence department, which by the time I got there, was gone, and so there was not a single person left on campus that even knew that I existed, and there was no one to help me with paperwork or any of the transfers of credit or anything. It was start over. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty [laughs] Um, continued to work on the degree out there, but got hired to work on a NASA[2] project that I did for five years, and then moved to California, where I stayed for another 18 years, before coming back to Orlando in 2005, um, basically, to be closer to family, and so I have lived here in Orlando ever since. Um, I started dancing—you were ask—gonna ask about the dancing thing—I started dancing when I was 10 years old, and I danced first with the Orlando Cloggers, which was a—a youth, square-dance clogging group that was sponsored by the City of Orlando, and from that I got involved in what’s called “round dancing,” which is kind of a hybrid between square dancing and ballroom dancing—ballroom dances and figures, but it’s cued in the same way that a square dance is called, and then directly involved in ballroom from that, and, uh—but because of the arthritis issues then it was like, This is not gonna be what I do with my life. I have to have something else to do, but as long as I’m able I can dance, and I’ve continued to do so for most of my life, um, and that’s taken me all over the world. In fact, I just got back from two weeks in Europe, where I was teaching for the 22nd year that I’ve been over there teaching at this event in Germany. Lamberty Um, you know, life in Orlando—mostly what my life about[sic] here is I’m taking care of my elderly mother. I am her primary caretaker, and, um, and then I do what work is available to me, in addition to that, and, you know, in my field if it can be, so designing software, computer systems and things, or doing people’s websites and such, but, um, mostly my life is about dealing with family, taking care of family. Cravero And, uh, what d—what did your family do? It was your—did your mother work? Or… Lamberty Uh, my father was an electrical engineer. Um, he had seven children. I’m the fifth of seven, and, uh, so my mother was basically a stay-at-home mom for a lot that, and then didn’t start really working until I was about 16, um, in Maryland, and then… [phone rings] Lamberty Go away. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And don’t do that again. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty I’ll make that stop. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty I should’ve thought of that first. Cravero Oh, that’s alright. Lamberty The only person who can make my phone ring now is my mother. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty [laughs]. Okay, um, my father was an electrical engineer. He did a wide variety of things for Swift[?] Martin Marietta [Corporation]. Well, actually, in Chicago, we moved down here for a job at Martin—which was before it was Lockheed Martin—and then, um, up to Maryland. Hated it. Cold weather. Not a[sic] interesting job for him. Came back to Florida at Harris Corporation, where they got involved with the satellite project, um, and then eventually ended up with TRW [Inc.] Space and Defense and retired from them. Um, I worked with TRW Space and Defense—was my first real job in my industry, and then, um, that—on the same project as my father, which was an extraordinary privilege. My father was brilliant and exceedingly humble, um, but just this brilliant man, and I had the privilege of spending five years working with him, and just, you know, being around that mind every day and seeing how he viewed the world, which was fascinating because growing up I didn’t experience my parents quite that way. Um, I grew up in a household where debate was the normal form of communication [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty You know, and I never knew what my parents thought about anything, because if one of ‘em would say something, the other one’d automatically take the opposite position, and so what did, you know—what did either of them actually believe about the world was almost impossible for me to determine, and, um, you know, in that time period, I actually got to learn about my father, and one of the things that I learned was that he wasn’t ashamed of me, because growing up, he never spoke to me, um, and I—I didn’t know why. It turned out he didn’t speak to me because he was partially deaf and he couldn’t hear me. So when my voice really changed then he could hear me, you know? Alone—the two of us, then he could hear me, and I walked into—he worked in a trailer in the desert, and I walked into his office one day for some reason, and on the wall was a framed poster of a dance exhibition that I had done when I was at Rollins, and I went home and I said to my mother, “Did you know that Dad has the poster from Rollins on the wall in—office?” And she said, “Oh, yes. Your father’s very proud of you,” and up until that very moment, what I had assumed was that he was embarrassed about me because I was a dancer and, you know, not like his other sons, and that really—that wasn’t true. So, you know, that was just—it was remarkable, and, you know, in an era where being gay was not okay, you know, having the security clearance and being gay was not okay, um, it was a very hard thing to do, um, and, you know, my parents were very Catholic. Uh, you know, like “know the pope” kind of Catholic. Um, there’s a photograph of my mother with John Paul II—just the two of them. You know, so it was a, you know—that was not okay. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And yet, there this poster was. It was an incredible experience. Um, but no. When I came back to Orlando, I continued to dance, and I had gotten involved with same-sex ballroom dancing. Uh, you know, two men dancing together, two women dancing together—which again, two women dancing together has always been socially acceptable; two men dancing together has not, and so, um—and I had a partner here in Orlando. We trained, we worked hard, we eventually won world titles together, and then he quit, and I didn’t have anything to do, so I had heard the [Orlando Gay] Chorus sing, and I thought, I can try this. I don’t sing, but I can try this, you know? I was in chorus in seventh and eighth grade, but, um, I didn’t get a good grade, and when I asked the teacher why she told me I didn’t have a good voice, and so I quit singing, and I never sang again. I mean I wouldn’t sing “Happy Birthday” to people for 35 years. So I joined the chorus and then, you know, started singing with them, and it was fun. It was—I didn’t have to be good. There were [laughs] zero expectations that I actually be good at anything. Not like work, not like dancing, you know—just show up, sing, gave a good time, and, you know, as it happens, apparently, I’ve gotten to the point where I’m okay as a singer, and, you know, had the—the privilege of being a part of the chorus now for six years, and it’s really—it is—it’s a lot of fun. Wonderful thing. Cravero That’s fantastic. Um, so, uh, can you tell us a little more about how you got involved in, uh, ballroom and Latin dancing? Um, what sort of work, uh, did you do as a board member on the—I saw that you did… Lamberty Oh. Cravero The North American Same-Sex Partner Dance Association [NASSPDA]… Lamberty You Googled me. Cravero I Googled. Lamberty Yes. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty Okay, my parents were square dancers. They had taken a square dance class here in Orlando, and they had what was called “hoedown,” which was in the parking lot of the, uh, um, uh, Colonial Plaza Mall in where—what now would be the—I guess the Walgreens or the CVS is in that corner—that was parking. They put up a tent one day and they just had the square dance callers with a whole bunch of people, and people were dancing in the parking lot [door closes], and I saw the Orlando Cloggers perform, and that’s what I wanted to do. I wasn’t quite old enough yet. You had to be 10 and I wasn’t 10 yet, and so as soon as I turned 10, then I could start the classes, and it was amazing. It was run by the city. It was $5 per family for the season—not $5 a week, not $5 a person. It was $5 for the entire thing—for three of us to go and take the classes, and I loved it. I thought it was awesome. I loved the dancing, so, you know, I learned to clog, I learned to square dance, and then I learned the round dancing, which was like ballroom, and, um, we moved to Maryland when I was in high school, and I can dance, and I got a job at an independent ballroom dancing studio as a dance teacher at the age of 16. I—and this is 1975—’75 —’76 —and I was making $16 an hour, which is basically still what a—a beginning dance instructor makes—same—same thing—but I was making $16 an hour teaching dance lessons, and I think the minimum wage was $2.85 [laughs]. So it’s like, Woo hoo. I had money. It’s like I’m 16 years old, I’ve got this job that I can—that I love, and I have money. It was amazing and—and I loved the dancing. Um, when I developed [rheumatoid] arthritis and—you know, what they told me was I’d never walk again. I was 100 percent disabled, and that was while I was here at UCF. You know, the campus was not that big, as it is now, but I couldn’t walk across campus, and the medication had this profound effect on me. I—I couldn’t communicate, um, you know, I couldn’t write coherently, I couldn’t make sense of what I was reading, and I couldn’t—I could not talk intelligently, um, and fortunately, there was a professor here in the Computer Science Department who understood what was going on, and she advised me to, you know, get the medical records brought in and have my record expunged and sealed so that all of that failing grade stuff that showed up, because of that, would not show up on my transcript ever, and without that I would have simply just failed, uh, graduate school, and probably never been able to get back in, um, and then, you know, got enough better that I could move and get back into school and get a job that was, uh—that I loved, um, and tried to dance, you know, as best I could, and it wasn’t always easy physically. I was—I was allergic to the non-steroidal anti-inflammatories, and so any of them that I would take would cause some kind of a very unpleasant neurological side effect, so it was just better to be in pain. So basically, for 30 years—so I just lived in pain, and didn’t tell anybody. You didn’t talk about it. Um, you know, if it was a bad day, you just tried to dance with your partner not touching actually, you know? It’s like you’re s—and don’t say. Don’t s—never tell anybody why you can’t do anything, you know? Um, yeah, it was really horrible, um, pretending, you know—pretending about a lot of things—pretending about being okay, pretending about not being gay, pretending about, you know, that my brain was working normally when it wasn’t. Basically, life was a whole lot about pretending a lot of things, and very painful—physically, psychologically, emotionally painful experience to live that way all the time. But, yeah, I got, you know—I danced as much as I could, and slowly, slowly over time. Basically, most dancers peak in their late 20s or early 30. It’s like, Mm, yeah. Not until I was in my late-40s, [laughs] you know, and, um, you know, d—did what teaching I could over the years. I mean, I’ve been traveling to Europe for over 20 years and teaching there, um, uh, various places around the United States, Canada, Japan. Uh, we did—a couple years ago, we did a three week tour in Japan—six different teaching events while we were there. It was just amazing—which in and of itself was fascinating because, you know, there’s a large community of dancers in Japan, and they knew of me and they—they would—when they would come to the United States, there[sic] was[sic] always be at the events that I was at, um, and they brought people over all the time to teach, and I asked—was a big, big international convention that I was teaching at—there was a huge group of Japanese there, and I got invited to the room party with the Japanese—was the only white person at this party, and, um, so I asked, you know—it’s like, you know, “When will I get invited to Japan?” And this—there was this discussion. This rapid discussion in Japanese, and the woman who spoke English best took me into the—the bathroom in the connected hotel rooms and closed the door and said to me, “We cannot invite you.” I was like, “Well, why?” And she goes, “Because whoever invites you would have to accept your shame.” I was like, “Oh.” So when I got contacted a couple years ago about coming over, there was an American woman living in Japan—I didn’t know her history, but she was an American woman living in Japan with the dancing—and so I wrote to her and said, “I’d love to come, but, you know, you need to know,” and she said to me, you know, “It’s not how it is now.” Things changed. Things changed because finally, the Japanese government had to acknowledge that there were people in Japan dying of AIDS,[3] and so everything changed when they acknowledged that—that these are Japanese people; therefore, they’re Japanese, and the laws changed, and the way that people behaved changed, and now it was just not a problem, and this was like, you know, social change on this huge scale in a couple of years, you know? Things that we have been fighting for in this country for 20 or 30 years and still don’t have—that they could achieve because, as a society, it’s more important that you’re Japanese than it is that you’re gay, you know? So she arranged this trip, we went, we had this amazing time, and it didn’t matter at all, you know? It didn’t matter at all. It matters more here than it does there. Um, you know, I mean I’m—and I still—I love dancing. Although at this point, I’m probably done. I don’t have a partner anymore. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And if I can’t dance on a regular basis then I lose the ability to dance, which anybody would. Any skill that you’ve developed, if you don’t use it, you lose it. It’s, you know—especially physical skills, but in my case, it’s not just that. Dancing’s what’s kept me well. Um, if I don’t move, I can’t move, and I’ve tried other things. I’ve, you know, gone to gyms, I’ve done swimming, I’ve done all kinds of things. The only thing that’s been really effective is the dancing that I do, and so basically, you know, 47 years of dancing and I don’t have a partner. If I don’t have a partner, I can’t dance. If I can’t dance, I don’t know how long it is that I can walk. That’s the equation. I mean, you know, we talked—I—walking over here from the parking garage was an ordeal, and that’s been, you know—it’s four—four months that I haven’t danced regularly. Going to Germany and having to dance all day, every day, you know? It’s like the first day was just horrible, and after that it was like, Oh, dancing. My body is happy. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty “It’s fine.” Yeah, so I get distracted easily. It’s okay [laughs]. Cravero Oh [laughs]. Lamberty [laughs] I’m chatty. Cravero Um, I was gonna—I have a question following up on that—is, um, what kind of—did you face any sort of challenges, um, early on, um, in a same-sex partner dance organization? Like what did you… Lamberty Oh, you were—asked about NASSPDA.[4] That was not the first. Cravero Mmhmm. Lamberty Um, the first organization kind of disappeared. It[?] was the United States same-sex dance, uh, organization that I was one of the founders of. I was also a—a—an honorary founding member of the European same-sex dance organization,[5] and then, at the same time that those two were formed, there was a world organization that was formed that I was on the committee that help form it, write the bylaws, was an officer of, and then there was a dispute about, you know: was that the right way to do this? Did it happen too fast? All that. So that organization shut down. The North American one disappeared, and a couple years later, the, um—or the U.S. one disappeared. Then the—they decided to do—try again, and we created the North American Same-Sex Partner Dance Association—NASSPDA—and I was, again, one of the founders, uh—original co—co-president with a woman, um, Barbara Zoloth, was one—one of my students for many years, and, um, you know, then—actually, I was the first honorary member of the organization when I went off the board. They voted me in, and, uh, you know—so I—I’ve been involved in the history of same-sex dancing in the United States since essentially its beginning. Um, I ran the first, uh—well, not the first. The first same-sex dance competition was a long time ago in New York—the first one we know of—but it was a one-time thing, and then nothing happened for years and years, but I put one together with, uh, my partner that[sic] I went to the Gay Games in 1998 with—Tom Slater—and a woman—a straight woman that[sic] was helping us—Ava Kaye—and, um, then the three of us decided this was important, and we put together, um, it was—I think it was “March Madness”—might have been the first one. It was either “March Madness” or “April Follies,” and then, the next one, you know—we did series of them that—that I ran with the two of them for many years, starting around 2000—2001—and then, when I moved away, I ran the next year remotely, you know, went back for it, but it was too much. So I turned it over to this organization—a non-profit in the [San Francisco] Bay area that has run it ever since, and so it’s the longest-running same-sex, uh, dance competition in North America, and longer than many of the ones in Europe, um, and, uh, so there’s the—you know, very small community of people involved in that in this country. We don’t have a history of partner dancing in this country in the way they do in Europe and other places in the world, but there are people that are[sic] really love it. It’s this wonderful thing to do. It’s social, it’s engaging, it challenges the mind and the body, um, it’s great exercise in a gentle way, um, and it’s fun. It’s just a tremendous amount of fun. Um, competing in the same-sex world is so different than the mainstream world. The mainstream world is very cutthroat, and the same-sex world is, you know, the—the—the people who’ve been to mainstream competition that come to one of the same-sex events is like, “What? It’s like, “You s—you act like you like each other. You know, this isn’t like a competition. It’s like a party. It’s a celebration,” and that’s exactly what it feels like. We are celebrating something that we can’t have. I mean there were rules against same-sex couples competing, uh, in regular competitions. Some of that has changed now, but there were rules against it. You weren’t allowed, you know, a—and it’s not just that you, you know, could if you wanted to. Y—you weren’t allowed, and while I wasn’t directly involved in a lot of the politics in the mainstream world to do that, um, I was behind the people who were, you know? I wasn’t—they hated me in the mainstream world of ballroom dancing from day one because I was an out[-of-the-closet] gay man doing ballroom dancing, and there were none. It was like, “Y—you can’t do that.” I got told when I was trying to compete as an amateur, and then as a professional, “Sh—y—you can’t be ‘out.’ You ca—you have to stop talking about this. You can’t bring a boyfriend.” I was like, “Yeah. No, I don’t—I y—I don’t need you to dance. I don’t do this for a living. You can’t make me,” and so—oh, they did not like me [laughs]. I mean I—when I was still trying to be an amateur, there were actually lawsuits filed against me. Try to keep me from dancing—trying to, you know, declare me “not an amateur.” I was—I had a sports lawyer. It was—I mean, I f—finally quit. I was spending about $5,000 a year defending my amateur status with the lawyer. It was like, This is ridiculous. This thing’s already so expensive. I was spending $20-25,000 a year dancing, and on top of that, I’ve got to spend lawyers’ fees? Nobody else has to do this. So I just—I gave up. I let them m—make me go pro, and then, you know, dance in Europe more than the United States, because in Europe nobody knows who I am. They don’t care. Then you get judged on the dancing. Uh, you know—you know, this thing that I’m passionate about. I just love doing it. I love teaching, I love dancing, you know? The, um—the next world championships for same-sex dancing is gonna be in Miami in August of 2017 at the, uh—the World Outgames, and I won’t be dancing, you know? I’ve—I’ve danced at every Gay Game since 1998. I’m the only one. The Gay Games in 1998 was the first time they had dancing, and my partner and I took third. We danced in Sydney[, Australia], and then, let’s see—it was, uh, Amsterdam[, Netherlands], Sydney[, Australia], I wanna say Chicago[, Illinois], Cologne[, Germany], Cleveland[, Ohio]. The next one’s Paris[, France] in ’18, and, uh—and then the Outgames. We danced in Montreal[, Canada] for the first one. We didn’t go to the next ones, and then, um—and then it’ll be Miami. I don’t have a partner. I don’t get to dance. It’s like a four-hour drive from where I live, and I won’t be dancing. It’s just so miserable. I don’t have a partner, and it’s something—you can’t do it alone, you know, and it’s really—you know, it’s hard to reflect on—the 47 years is coming to an end, and I don’t have a say in that. It’s just gonna happen. Cravero It’s tough [sighs]. Um, well, let me see. I—I—you already discussed, uh—I saw that you had to—you overcame rheumatoid arthritis, actually, in a profile I was reading online. Um… Lamberty Oh, was it the one in The Orlando Sentinel? Cravero I think it was, yeah. Lamberty Yeah. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty With a picture of me and the dog. Cravero That’s right. Lamberty Yeah. Cravero Then that was the one. Lamberty [laughs]. Cravero Um, oh… Lamberty You’ll see. Cravero I also saw there that you did, um—you were a technical consultant on the rewrite of a DVIDA[6] American Smooth Bronze Syllabus manual. Could… Lamberty Oh, yeah, DVIDA. Cravero Could you explain what that is and describe the work you did on that? Lamberty Um, DVIDA is, uh, oh, Dance Vision—D—Dance Vision International—DVIDA—of—Dance Vision International is the company. DA—o I don’t remember what it stands for. A friend of mine, um, Diane Jarmolow, that I used to coach and have known forever, um, she got—she contacted me about helping with the manual, which was very nice. It was great. It was really lovely to be asked, but I’m very technical. People know that I have this profound very deep understanding of dancing, which happened while I lived in New Mexico. Um, I couldn’t dance much. It was, you know, a 60-mile drive to the closest dance studio, which I would do. There[?] was a—a woman there that did some dancing that I could do, but we were only allowed to dance after the studio closed at night, ‘cause the owner didn’t want people seeing us because we didn’t fit the profile—she was the teacher there, and he was afraid that we would scare people off, you know? It’s like wrong level, wrong kind of dancing for what the studio was about, and so two weeknights a week, I would drive to El Paso[, Texas], be there at 10 o’clock at night, and dance ‘til midnight, and drive home and have to be at work at seven in the morning. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty Um, but, um, while I was there, I met this woman who did ballet, and her husband—fiancé was a PhD kinesiologist at New Mexico State University and he wanted a project, but, you know, at the time—this was when they were doing a lot of things with, you know, analyzing on video tape athletic performance, ‘cause they were looking at, you know, runners on treadmills or swimmers in float tanks or cyclists on stationary bicycles, and seeing, you know, how do you optimize the human body in motion—and he didn’t want to do any of that stuff. So what I did was taught his w—his fiancé how to ballroom dance while he analyzed what we were doing, which, basically, no one had ever done before. No one had ever looked at the—the—the actual human body while it was dancing in this way, and n—not just one body, but two—how two bodies worked together, and he did this analysis of it with—with knowing nothing about dancing. So all of the language of dancing that had been used for 80-90 years to teach it had nothing to do with what he wrote about… Cravero Right. Lamberty Or what he analyzed. So not, “Here’s what somebody has always said about what we’re doing,” but, “This is what the bodies are doing,” and I—so he wrote about that and then I got all that information, and then I had that, so I could write about dancing in—in the dance world, and I wrote papers that would get published about here’s why the feet do what they do, here’s the way that your hold actually works in the frame—you know, not what Patrick Swayze says about it in Dirty Dancing… Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty But what’s actually going on, and that kind of revolutionized the way that dancing was looked at all over the world, and my—my work got spread all over, um, and so because of that I became well-known for this level of technical understanding, and when Diane needed help with the new manuals they were writing, then I got an email. It’s like, “You willing?” It’s like [claps hands] yes.” [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty “I’ve been waiting for this.” Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty “Fix the stuff that’s wrong.” Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And so, yeah. I worked on those manuals, and, in fact, my former partner is now working on the new set. He’s up in, uh, Indiana, and he was actually just down here for three days to talk to me about it, ‘cause he’s actually—he’s now the consultant for the next set of stuff that’s being done, um, but yeah, I got a credit in the—in the—in the book and everything, and it’s like “technical consultant,” and it was all this weird stuff. What’s the difference between “brush to” and “brush toward”? What’s the difference between a “brush” and a “collect”? You know, it’s like how to—what’s the difference between “side and slightly forward” and “forward and slightly side,” and it’s like all this really technical stuff, which I’m well-suited to because I love language, you know, from my own issues with language—couldn’t speak for a long time. I love language. I’m a mathematician. So, you know, my—I had a double major at Rollins—mathematics and English—and the dancing is mathematical. The partner dancing is a—is a mathematical construct actually, and then I had all this understanding of what was going on because of this analysis that had been done by this PhD kinesiologist. It’s like, you know—it’s perfect. Love it. Cravero So cool. Lamberty Yeah. Cravero [laughs] So, um, could you tell us, uh—so you joined the, uh, [Orlando] Gay Chorus. You talked a little bit about how you got involved. Um, do you have a favorite production that you did that you can recall? Lamberty Um, no [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty It’s—it’s funny. I don’t have a sticky memory for lyrics. Lyrics are so hard for me to learn—that they don’t stick in my brain very well, and, uh, so, you know, people will say, “Oh, we sang this five years ago,” and I’m going, “Really? I was here then. Did we? I don’t remember,” um, but I—I love singing with the chorus. I—I have no interest in doing any of the solo stuff or anything like that. I have zero—I love singing with the chorus, and we do two major concerts a year—the spring and the holiday. Um, I like the spring concerts, but I tend to love the holiday stuff because the music is different, you know? The—the Christmas stuff, the holiday stuff in general—it’s just got this wonderful character, and, uh, learning—learning about music. I mean, I always had to know something about music because of the dancing. I played piano for several years and I—it was the first thing—I didn’t understand at the time, but it hurt. It got to the point where it hurt, and so I quit, and then I was a great believer in I’m young and healthy. Park across campus and walk, and, uh, at Rollins, I was in the math program. The math courses were on the fourth floor of the [Archibald Granville] Bush Science Center. I always took the stairs. I got to the point where I couldn’t climb the stairs. So I didn’t know what was going on, um, but, you know, how did I get involved with the chorus? My partner quit, and I thought, Well, I won’t be dancing. I need something to do that’s interesting, that will challenge my mind, that will be fun, that will get me out in the world, ‘cause I don’t have a regular job. I don’t meet people. I don’t, you know, have people at work. I don’t go out to lunch. I don’t meet people. So I’ll join the chorus. It’ll be fun, and it has been. It’s really lovely, um, but—and I was afraid to sing, ‘cause I hadn’t—I’d been told I didn’t sing well. Well, they didn’t care, you know? Now, it’s a little different. The—the chorus actually is[sic] improved dramatically from then. Well, you know, the work of Jim Brown—here at UCF—was our director at the time that I joined, and he did great work with the chorus, and now we have a new director, who’s very, very choral. Very, you know—the sound is gonna be the sound kind of thing, and, uh, I don’t know that I could get in now. You know, if I had—if I tried to join now, I doubt that they would take me. Now, I’m okay. I mean I’ve learned, but, you know, between the two of them, I learned a lot. Understanding a music that’s fundamentally different. I love that. I love learning, and then being with the group and doing. So, you know, particular thing that we sing that I like the best? No, no. I mean, every concert there’s something that I end up really loving, which is usually a surprise. It’s not the thing that I think at first that I’m gonna like, and, you know, something that’s not my favorite, you know—sing it anyway, um, and most of the stuff is like, Oh, this is fun or not, you know? Some things are more fun to sing. Some things—just the sound of them. We did, um, in the last concert before we went to Denver for GALA[7]—one of the things we sang was a song for—“A Prayer for Children,” and it’s an old s—piece. It was written, um, I think about Croatia during the [Croatian] War [of Independence] there, and it’s gorgeous. It’s hard, but it’s so beautiful. Um, when I first joined it was like I had to be surrounded by other people singing my part, and so it was—you know, it’s like, Mm. I can’t stand next to somebody who’s doing anything different than me. I don’t sing that well, and now, normally, where I get placed is standing next to the altos. I sing bass—I sing low bass. So it’s like bass, baritone—we usually sing the same thing, but not always—and then the altos, and so I’m standing next to an alto and the—in the front, and I can hear the rest of the chorus, and it’s so beautiful sometimes. I mean, there’s pieces that we do—the fun stuff I love. It’s great and fun to sing, but the s—I love the things that the sound of them is—it’s amazing to experience, and that’s what I’ve always looked for in the dance music, you know—the sound of the music that I choose for my own choreography is what I’m interested in, but, you know, chorus is great. It’s—it’s always been interesting to belong, you know? There’s—like any other human endeavor and organization, there’s groups that form and factions, and the politics of it and all that. It’s normal. I’m used to that, but at the heart of it, there’s this thing that we’re doing something that matters as a group. Um, when the chorus was formed 26 years ago, you know, the—the small group of people that did that, they were risking, you know, employment. You know, to be associated with a gay group publicly like that, many of them could have been fired for it. Um, it was a brave thing to do then, um, and y—you know, it’s not like that n—now. We belong. It’s okay in Orlando. But, you know, this summer’s been kind of insane. We had had our concert, and the—the weekend of the shooting at Pulse there were several things going on. Um, every year right around that time there is the Orange Blossom [Dance] Festival, which is a big country western dance competition, and I always try to go. Um, well, at least one night, go by, dance and visit with people, ‘cause I know a lot of people, and if like—convention friends—you see them once a year, and—‘cause I don’t go to the other stuff, and I’m not a country western dancer, but some of these people do other things. Some of them are involved in the same-sex ballroom, um, and it’s often my birthday, ‘cause my birthday’s June 11th, and so, normally what would happen is I would go on the Saturday. It’s the better night. If you go Friday, people don’t stay up that late ‘cause a lot of them have to get up in the morning and compete—dance with their students or dance in some way, and Saturday’s better. A lot of the competition is over. The stuff on Sunday is different, and so, you know, go there, dance all evening. Around midnight or so, get a group of people and we’ll go out. Go someplace where there is music, um, and—music that you can dance to—partner dance to, and that has, in fact, been Pulse in the past, eh, when it matched up. Latin Night—if it was going on—e could go there and dance. That’d be great. Um, this year, I went on Friday because Saturday night we had one of our, uh, non-outreach—there’s another word—I—I forget this word every time I go to do it, uh—cabaret. We have three cabaret performances a year. One of them’s at the Parliament House. It’s called “Uncut.” It’s the raunchy one, and then we have the—the, um—the h—February Valentine’s Day one. That’s the love one, and then, the—we have the summer one, and this year, it was early in the summer. It’s often later, and, um—and it happened to be on that Saturday, and since it was my birthday weekend—I wasn’t singing. I—it was like, I’ll go, and they had these VIP’s tickets with the reception and the dinner and then the thing, and it’s like, I’ll go to that. So I had the ticket and I went. It was wonderful, had great time, and then it was done and nobody wanted to really go out, and I did not want to drive all the way out to this hotel and see what’s going on because it was late. Any other year, I would have been at the hotel with the dancers and we would have been going to Pulse and arriving about 12:30 and staying until they closed or later—make them stay open and play music. So I would have had, you know, 25-30 people from out of town, who just love to dance, be there with me, and I just, you know—when—I’m tired. I think I’ll go home. That was the decision. So Sunday morning, I wake up. I look at my phone and I—there’s all these text messages. “Are you okay?” “Are you okay?” And I’m thinking, It was one singer. Yes, I know we sing at The Plaza [Live], you know, People know we sing at The Plaza. I’m fine. I’m fine. I’m fine, and then I get into the shower and turn on the radio [laughs]. It was like, Turn off the shower, go back to the phone. It’s like, “Oh, my God. I—I had no idea,” you know—listening to the news. I was like, Wow, you know, nut for being tired, I would have been there. I would[?], uh—bringing people. So I don’t—I’m not a Facebook person really, but I looked to see, and I saw that there was gonna be a special Mass. The, um—there’s a gay, Catholic group in Orlando, and the priest who runs that, uh, used to sing in the chorus with us, and so I take my mother to Mass every Sunday—very Catholic—in Winter Park—St. Margaret Mary [Catholic Church] —very affluent—and, you know—and after Mass and I was waiting to see would[sic] they say anything, and they—and they did. Um, it wasn’t hugely specific, but it was, you know—they acknowledged what had happened, and the violence. Not that it was a gay attack or anything, but—but at least they acknowledged it at Mass, and we left immediately from there and went to the—to the place, which is a bar, you know? St. Matthew’s [Tavern at the Orlando Beer Garden]. Is—it used to be I wanna say Revolution—on Mills[Avenue]… Cravero Right. Lamberty Next to the [Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender Community] Center [of Central Florida]. Alright, that’s where they have Mass, and so we went, and, you know, we s—we went to Mass there, and, you know, at some point in the afternoon, there was a message that came out about—we had been invited to sing at, um, Joy MCC,[8] and I was like, “Absolutely, I’ll be there.” It was massive. When[?] you show up and there’s all these cameras, and they have relegated them to this corner in the back, and there’s[sic] way too many people, and there’s some seating reserved in the front for the chorus, and there’s not enough. There’s so many of us that showed up, and I felt terrible. I had to sit, ‘cause I—I couldn’t stand. My hip hurt, my knee hurt. I couldn’t—I couldn’t stand for the whole thing. I had to take a chair away from somebody else, you know, but—and then, it came time to sing. So we lined up in the front and, um, we had “True Colors” and, um, “You’ll Never Walk Alone,” and we sang, and, um, by the time I got home, you know, I looked at Facebook and there was a video that had been posted. It was CBS News, and the CBS newsman thought he was so clever. He had gotten the camera spot that was right in the center aisle, and so when we went to do “True Colors,” of course, that’s where the conductor stood, and right in front of him was the soloist, Caitlyn[sp], and so he had a completely blocked view [laughs] of the soloist. He couldn’t get her face—couldn’t get her face, but there’s the camera and there am I. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And out of this like two and a half minute video, about 60 seconds of it is on my face, and this got posted on Facebook, and re-p—tagged, and posted and posted, and by the time I got home, I had messaged from 11 countries, and it was overwhelming. I mean, you know—we didn’t know a lot yet. We didn’t even know really how many people were dead yet. I didn’t know whether or not I knew anybody. I did—nobody well, no close friends, but it’s a small community. You know—you don’t know what to do. You know what there was to do? Sing. As it happens, I don’t have a day job. So when we get asked to go and sing and—I can say, “Yes.” I can show up at one o’clock at UCF across town for something, or drive out to the [Orange County] Convention Center at crack of dawn and not worry about being late to work, or—I could show up. That’s what I could do, and it was fascinating to see. We had the Sunday night there and then Monday night at Dr. Phillips [Center for the Performing Arts] on the lawn, which was not supposed to be what it was, but turned into this thing, and—and it just started happening, and we had GALA [Choruses Festival] coming. We knew—and that was gonna change. Everything was gonna change. So we got invited to the—to sing at the formal thing at Dr. Phillips on the 28th.[9] I was flying out. I was going early. I have an ex-boyfriend that lives in Denver[, Colorado], and four years ago, I got to visit with him. This year, I was going to do the same. Go early, spend some time with him, meet the husband—you know, of 11 years that I had never met, um—and so I wasn’t—I wasn’t at the first concert at Dr. Phillips inside, um, and I had a few days. I mean, there had been so many things. I think Carol said that between June 20th—the 12th and the 28th, there were 20 outreach things that we did, and I lost count how many I did. You know, some of them were just the ensemble things and s—one or two people, but—but, you know, 20 things that the chorus was involved in, and I had like at least nine that I did in those few days, and I got to Denver, and I had time away from all of it, you know? It was no longer in the news every day, and not what everybody’s talking about. Just time—and, uh, people talk about processing. It was like, Oh, this is what that means. Time to really think—to—to stop and feel, and then GALA would come, and I knew—I knew what it was gonna be like. I mean, GALA’s crazy anyway, and it was gonna be different. We were gonna, you know—kind of like, if you’re gonna be a part of this, you accept an obligation about certain things. I’m used to—I’m used to being a public figure. Mm—I’m a—I’m well-known in the world of dancing. In the world of same-sex dancing, I’m the grandfather. I’m known. Um, I was well-known in my work in California. I mean, we didn’t talk about it, but I’ve—I’ve done things that people don’t understand, you know? I worked on—when you type on the computer and it offers you the corrected spelling[10] or look ahead,[11] I developed that for the very first system that ever had it—was the—the satellite control system that I did for NASA in the [19]80s. That didn’t become available for a very, very long time. I developed that. The very first clickable interface to purchase—“online shopping” is what we call it now—I developed that. The—the idea that you can get credit by filling out an online form, that was revolutionary. I did that. I designed that. Um, then when you go to an ATM[12] and you put in your money or your check, and it just reads it and tells you—instead of putting that in an envelope and writing on the envelope, and a person has to open it and count it. I did that—not—not for ATMs. Didn’t fit in an ATM when I did it. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty But that technology was something I developed. That’s what I worked on. I’ve done all these things with computers that have transformed the world as we know it, and that are now a part of everybody’s existence in the Western world, and how we just interact all the time, and my name is not on any of it. I have no patents. I’m not famous for any of it, but the people who were there, they all knew, you know? I walked into a room of computer nerds in the Bay area. Everybody knew who I was. I was the guy that had won a congressional award for software. There wasn’t anybody else that had done that and never has been, you know? I was the guy that walked up to Steve Jobs and told him he was wrong. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty [laughs] He was not happy with me. Um, and I—I know what it’s like to be public, and what the chorus was facing was—we were gonna be the face of Orlando—the face of Pulse at this huge thing. When somebody comes walking up and they have to say something to you, or they have to express how they feel, the obligation is listen. Let them. Let them feel what they feel. Let them share what they have to say. Because at that point, it’s no longer about us. People need the space to be able to express, to—to grieve, to process, and we were gonna be their outlet for doing that. James [A. Rode] was not exactly the kind of director that was used to talking a lot, especially in a performance. The first time he was involved with a performance of the chorus, we sang. He probably said six words to the audience. Not his thing. We were in the waiting area backstage and he spoke to us. We had this set of songs, carefully chosen—changed from what it was supposed to be. I mean, we had—our—our set for GALA was celebratory when we started. Had to change—the message had to change, and some of the music was not music that people wanted to necessarily be singing, um, but it told a story, and he talked to us. “We have an obligation. Find a connection to that music. Relay the message that we’re bringing. It’s hard,” you know, “There’s suffering, there’s pain, and there’s hope. It’s up to us. Create hope, create love.” Like it was beautiful. So we all walk onstage and we start to sing, as we [inaudible] the ovation, and, you know, you just have to stand there and take it. I used to teach people, “You just gotta stand there and take it.” I made my staff learn to be acknowledged. It’s not easy holding up. It’s not easy, and what did we do? Well, we have to live in Orlando and sing [sniffles]. [inaudible] cause is[?] [inaudible], and then, James read his statement to the audience. None of us had a clue what it said, and then—I mean—oh, God. The man’s eloquent, you know? He’s a schoolteacher, he’s educated, he knows how to write. It was good. It was devastating. It was like—and then, “Let’s sing.” It was like, Oh, no. You’ve gotta be kidding. It’s like—like—I—but, you know, at that point, it didn’t matter. We could’ve stood there and flapped our arms like birds and nobody would’ve cared, and so—but we tried. I mean, by the second verse—it was “You’ll Never Walk Alone”—by the second verse, we—we could maybe sort of sing, and the walkout into that crowd of people. I remember being in Washington, D.C., you know, mid-[19]90s in like the second March on Washington [for Lesbian, Gay, and Bi Equal Rights and Liberation]. Being on the subway when I lived in the Bay area—you know, one of gay centrals—it’s like, “No.” You know when you ride on BART,[13] you’re not safe. Doesn’t matter that it’s San Francisco[, California], you know? You—y—y—there’s a way of being circumspect, and I’m—I spent my whole childhood being abused because I was different. I didn’t understand that “different” meant “gay,” but they did. I went[?], you know—I—it was a normal part of my experience to be physically attacked on a regular basis. Thrown into lockers, you know, punched and hit—and that was just normal, and n—there was[sic] no adults who really cared. My mother asked me the other day it was like, “Where—wa—was I affectionate as a mother?” And I said, “Not to me,” And she was shocked—just shocked. It’s like, “I’m the wrong one to ask.” I didn’t let anyone touch me. From—from the day—first day of first grade—new school, you know, didn’t know anybody, new city—and the first thing that happened to me was to be attacked. Yeah, I didn’t let people touch me. Dancing was my way of touch. Other than that, no one touched me, you know? Not hug people, barely would shake hands. Not allowed to touch, and you walk out to this—wanting to hug you. I’m not good at hugging. You have to let people, and I had scheduled my flights that I would actually not stay to the very end. I was so grateful. I couldn’t take it anymore [sniffs]. At GALA, they have “coffee concerts” in the morning. They, um—a longer time slot to do something with. A very small, Canadian group had one of ‘em. It was very crowded. I managed to get a seat. It was marvelous. It was funny. Almost every one of the choruses added something in to acknowledge. you know, It was very—uh, um, I don’t want to seem callous, but it was like, you know, one more—“Thanks,” you know, [laughs] but—and the Canadians change theirs—program too a little bit, but what was fascinating to me was they had this woman in a hijab singing with them [sniffs]. She was fascinating. Soaring soprano voice, phenomenally animated—just, you know, capture everyone’s eye when she was onstage, and they—they sang a song in, um, not Farsi, but, um, Arabic, because of her, and, you know, it’s normal, you know? People are leaving the stage and you line the hallways and everybody comes in. Everybody [inaudible]. So I just waited. I waited. I waited. We had—we had, uh, you know—people had ribbons that we had made and stickers and the Pulse logos and there was like [inaudible], and I wanted to talk to this woman, and everybody wanted to talk to this woman. She had friends there—all this—and I waited, and finally. Finally, there was a camera crew following her around, and I just waited until she was kind of done and all settled down, and she saw me in the shirt—the shirt, and she looked at me and I looked at her, and I put out my hand and it had one of the Pulse stickers in it, and I said to her, “I want you to have this,” and it was extraordinary. Here’s this woman, who turns out isn’t a woman. She’s—she’s a transsexual in process, who is a convert to Islam, who decided to be Orthodox, found an organization in Canada that would accept her for who she is, you know? Coming to America to a major city after a shooting that’s related to, you know, an Islamic fundamentalist supposedly—not really, but that’s the perception—and as we stood there, we talked—I don’t know—20 minutes. It was amazing, and, you know, the stories that she had to tell. Just m—this is—this is what bravery looks like. I was like, “Let’s get the picture,” you know? I don’t do pictures. I always forget, but I have my picture with her. You know, put it on Facebook. It’s mine. There were—there’s been a lot of things. Um, one of the outreaches was at, um, [John F.] Kennedy Space Center, and not many people could go. It was like, workday, Tuesday, all day, have to be able to get on base. Not everybody would pass the minimal clearance requirements, um, but I could go, and, um, I was like, Oh, this’ll be interesting, you know? I wonder in anybody will know my project, and that was—it was—and, you know, when I worked with TRW Space and Defense, being gay was not a good thing, um, and when we show up it’s gonna be this auditorium full of people, who— ‘cause they have an organization now. It’s like NASA has an organization for gay people. Different world, and—and, yes, you know—people know the project that I worked on. It’s still a meaningful thing. People actually, you know, there were people who know my father’s name. It was amazing, and that was hard. That was—for me, that was the hardest one to sing there. There’s still—I just—we just went Sunday to the movie theater, ‘cause Tony Romero—I don’t know what his last name is—invited the chorus and a few other people, ‘cause Ellen [DeGeneres] gave him a showing of Finding Dory, which I did not see, and it’s like, Okay, this is lovely. Get to go—it’s changing. We get to reflect differently. We get to look to a future. The obligation to create something meaningful is on those who survive, who are after. It’s like funerals aren’t for the dead. They’re for the living. We’re living. We get to choose what this means. We get to choose what happens. I want—I want there to be a difference. I want the world to wake up and know, and I don’t want it to be because it was a gay club in Orlando, but something has to do it. You know, you take the populations of Great Britain, and Australia, Denmark, and Sweden, and, you know, several other countries combined—is less than the population of the United States, and we have, you know, up 50 times the murder rate that they do. It’s not just because we’re stupid; it’s because they have gun laws that are meaningful and we don’t. You know, Australia had a mass shooting[14] and they changed their world. It was sane. We’re insane. We’re living in an insane society. I want sanity. I’m tired of it costing lives. I don’t look forward to my birthday next year, ‘cause it’s gonna be, you know, the weekend of the one-year anniversary. I don’t want there to be a one-year anniversary. There will be. I’ll be there. I wish I didn’t have to. It’s so preventable. We have to be responsible for what happens next. I have to be responsible for what happens next. Cravero [clears throat]. Well, I guess, what sort of, uh—what would you hope the long-term consequences will be for the Orlando gay community, and really just for the city—the larger city or the—just maybe even society from this? Lamberty You know, [sighs] it was interesting. Um, after this, it’s like you’re driving around town and there’s rainbow lights everywhere, and like, you know, it was August. W—my brother was in town for the weekend or the day with this wife. They live in Melbourne[, Florida], and we were gonna go to brunch up in Longwood. Driving and getting off at the exit in I[nterstate] 4, it was raining, and it’s—and below it is the banner—“Orlando Untied”—with the rainbow flag. I was looking at it, it’s like [inaudible]. I took a picture out of the window of the car, and we got to the restaurant and, you know, had this wonderful brunch, and leaving the restaurant, they have one of those chalkboard things, you know—two-sided, and on the front side g—walking in is all the specials, and on the back side was the “Orlando Strong”—“Orlando United,” but, you know, I don’t—where was I? Longwood somewhere. Casselberry, and there is the CVS [Pharmacy] with the electronic sign out front that cycles through its set of stuff. One of which was “Orland Strong.” I was like—I think it would be beautiful if what would just happen is that we could be the “City of Rainbows.” W—let’s, you know, that—somehow [laughs] the gay community got the rainbow flag. It’s like, Wow, that was smart [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty I don’t know if they were actually planning that far in advance, but it was like, Wow, we co-opted the rainbow [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty It’s like, That’s awesome. It’s like “The City Beautiful.” It’s like “The City of Rainbows.” Wow, I would—I would love for all of these city buildings and—and banks and everything else just like keep putting up rainbows. They’re beautiful. We can create all the meaning we want from them. They’re beautiful. That would be a wonderful thing to have happen. Um, I would—I want gun control that makes sense. I don’t know that we’re gonna get it. I don’t know how we’re gonna get it, because we—our society is literally insane, but I would like that to be an outcome. I would like that, you know—we have this political season that we’re dealing with. We’re dealing with the rise of fundamentalism. People don’t understand what that means. Fundamentalism is a particular thing in philosophy. It’s—it’s not just an extreme point of view—that’s orthodoxy. It’s not just that “I’m right and you’re wrong.” It is: “I’m right, you’re wrong,” and the existence of other ideas, other beliefs cannot be tolerated, and must be suppressed or eliminated by whatever means necessary. That’s fundamentalism. We’ve seen it in religions—not just Islam. I mean, you know, American Christianity is full of its fundamentalism. “You will believe the way that I say it’s supposed to be or”—and when, you—political fundamentalism—“I’ll get what I want in this bill or this bill will never happen.” There is no such thing as compromise in fundamentalism. Nationalism is a form of fundamentalism. Brexit is fundamentalism. The rise of these nationalistic parties in Europe—that’s fundamentalism. You know, even the idea that the news doesn’t tell us the facts. They tell us how we’re supposed to feel about what happens. No, you don’t get to tell me how to feel, but somehow that’s become part of news. No, but that’s representive[sic] of fundamentalism. It’s, “You don’t get to have your opinion.” There is “the opinion” and that’s it. As long as that’s true, we’re not gonna see gun control. We’re not gonna see a society where it’s truly safe to be gay. We’ve made huge progress, but that doesn’t change the way that people think, or believe—believe is worse. Belief takes no foundation. There’s—doesn’t have to be proved, and anything that stands in the way of it can be discounted. We sing, you know—you know, we talk about the—what is our purpose? We’re gonna change hearts and minds from musical excellence. The opportunity that’s been presented to the Orlando Gay Chorus because of this horrific thing is phenomenal. We get an audience that we would never have had, and we get to stand up, and we get to sing, and we get to do it as a gay group, and people get to hear good music, good singing, and it has a message, and we’re gay. I—you know, I talked to the leadership in the chorus and said, “Don’t be afraid. It’s—you’re not—there’s nothing wrong—there’s nothing wrong with capitalizing on this moment.” We’ve said for a long time that we want to stand up and mean something. The opportunity’s been handed to us. The mistake would be to not take it. Say, “Yes.” Do these things. Put the message out there, and do it for the right reasons. I said to Tony the other day—the business manager—“You know, there are a lot of survivors in a lot of ways. Most of them can’t—can’t stand up and talk to the world. It’s not a part of who they are,” but he can, and I remember eighth grade. There was this thing happening, you know—one of the kids in school—and I went home and I complained to my mother about it, and she said, “Who did you talk to?” I was like, “No one. Not me,” You know, and she’s, “Well, you know? You should.” I was like, “Why?” It’s like, “Well, because you can.” So the next day, I marched myself into the principal’s office and complained on behalf of somebody who couldn’t. Those who can need to. Tony can stand up and talk to the world about his experience, and maybe change the world’s thinking—little bit by little bit by doing that. he should. He’s not opportunistic. He has a message that needs to be heard, and he’s capable of delivering it, and he can do that on behalf of victims everywhere. He should. The chorus has an opportunity. We should. We can. It’s not opportunistic. Yes, does it move our agenda forward—the agenda we’ve had f—long before this happened? Absolutely, but it’s still the right thing to do, and it’s for the right reasons, and that’s what we should do. We should keep saying “yes” to the opportunities that arise, and over time—it’s already happening—that they’re—they’re not about that anymore. We got to sing with the Second Harvest Food Bank [of Central Florida], because I go to their dinners, and I know the organizer there, and she likes me. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty And after this happened, she said to me, “You sing with the Gay Chorus.” I was like, “Yes, I do.” “I wanna talk to you about it.” I was like, “Not the right one to talk to, but, boy, can I get you in touch with the person who is,” and we got to do this amazing event for an audience who we would otherwise never touch. Changed the perception of a lot of things. We got to sing the national anthem[15] at the First Responders’ Breakfast. This is not a group of people who are gonna just suddenly say, “Oh, gosh. We need to have the Orlando Gay Chorus come and sing.” We’re gonna sing for the AFL-CIO.[16] It’s like Jimmy Hoffa’s[17] union.[18] Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty We’re gonna sing for them. The gay chorus in Orlando is gonna sing for Jimmy Hoffa’s union. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty That was not gonna happen before, and now, it is. So, you know, what’s gonna come of this? I hope that. I hope lots of things like that. I hope a dialogue, in music for us, that lets people have a different experience of what “gay” means, and then, maybe the world really can change. Cravero Thank you so much for sharing that with us today, Richard. I really appreciate it. Is there anything else you’d like to add? I mean I—that was a great—that was a great place to end, I think. Lamberty No, you don’t—you don’t want to get me started on Lucy.[19] It’s okay. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty [laughs] Read the blog.[20] Cravero We can always do a second interview. Lamberty [laughs]. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty Read—read the blog on Lucy. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty Did you find my blog? Cravero I did. Lamberty Yeah. Cravero I did. Lamberty Yeah. Cravero Well, that’s an interview for another time. Lamberty Oh, yeah. Cravero [laughs]. Lamberty This—thank you. You know, it’s like—this’ll go into an archive, and—and who knows? Maybe some researcher a hundred years from now will look at it, but probably, other than that, nothing. Cravero Aw. Lamberty That’s okay. Cravero It’s fantastic. Well, this is, uh—this has been Geoffrey Cravero with Richard Lamberty in the conference room of the Center for Digital Humanities and Research at UCF in Orlando, Florida, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2016. <div> <div> [1] University of Central Florida. </div> <div> [2] National Aeronautics and Space Administration. </div> <div> [3] Acquired immune deficiency syndrome. </div> <div> [4] North American Same-Sex Partner Dance Association. </div> <div> [5] European Same-Sex Dancing Association (ESSDA). </div> <div> [6] Dance Vision International Dancers Association. </div> <div> [7] Gay and Lesbian Association of Choruses. </div> <div> [8] Joy Metropolitan Community Church. </div> <div> [9] Of June. </div> <div> [10] Spell check. </div> <div> [11] Typeahead. </div> <div> [12] Automatic teller machine. </div> <div> [13] Bay Area Rapid Transit. </div> <div> [14] Port Arthur massacre. </div> <div> [15] The Star-Spangled Banner. </div> <div> [16] American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations. </div> <div> [17] Born James Riddle Hoffa. </div> <div> [18] Correction: Jimmy Hoffa was the president of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT). </div> <div> [19] Lamberty’s now-deceased dog. </div> <div> [20] http://rexl.org/. </div> </div> 2016 Orlando nightclub shooting A Prayer for Children acquired immune deficiency syndrome AFL-CIO AIDS American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations April Follies ATM machines automated teller machine Ava Kaye ballroom dancers ballroom dancing Barbara Zoloth BART Bay Area Rapid Transit bullying cash machines Casselberry Catholicism Catholics CBS News Center for Humanities and Digital Research CHDR Christian fundamentalism Christianity coffee concerts Colonial Plaza Mall Croatian War of Independence dance instructors Dance Vision International Dancers Association dancers defense Denver Diane Jarmolow Dr. Phillips Center for the Performing Arts DVIDA American Smooth Bronze Syllabus manual El Paso Ellen DeGeneres ESSDA European Same-Sex Dancing Association Facebook Finding Dory fundamentalism fundraisers GALA Choruses Festival Gay and Lesbian Association of Choruses Gay Games Geoffrey Cravero GLBT GLBT Community Center of Central Florida gun control gun regulations gun violence Harris Corporation hate crimes hijab HIV hoedowns homophobia homosexuality human immunodeficiency virus infection James A. Rode Japan Jim Brown John F. Kennedy Space Center Joy MCC Joy Metropolitan Community Church Kennedy Space Center Vigil kinesiology KSC Latin Night LGBT LGBT Center of Central Florida LGBTIQ LGBTQ Lockheed Martin Longwood March Madness March on Washington for Lesbian, Gay, and Bi Equal Rights and Liberation Martin Marietta Corporation mass shootings NASA NASSPDA National Aeronautics and Space Administration New Mexico North American Same-Sex Partner Dance Association OGC online credits online shopping Orange Blossom Dance Festival Orange County Convention Center orlando Orlando Cloggers Orlando Gay Chorus Orlando Strong Orlando United Orthodox Muslims outreach events Parliament House Port Arthur massacre Pulse Pulse massacre Pulse nightclub Pulse nightclub shooting Pulse tributes RA rainbow flags religious fundamentalism rheumatoid arthritis Rollins College round dancing same-sex San Francisco Second Harvest Food Bank of Central Florida space spell check square dancers square dancing St. Margaret Mary Catholic Church St. Matthew’s Tavern at the Orlando Beer Garden Steve Jobs terrorism terrorist attacks terrorists The Center The Plaza Live Tom Slater transgender True Colors TRW Space and Defense Park TRW, Inc. Space and Defense typeahead UCF Uncut University of Central Florida vigils World Outgames You'll Never Walk Alone Yugoslav Wars Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A History of Central Florida Collection Alternative Title History of Central Florida Collection Subject Podcasts Documentaries Description A History of Central Florida Podcast series explores Central Florida's history through the artifacts found in local area museums and historical societies. Contributor <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> Cassanello, Robert Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/70" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida. Language eng Type Collection Coverage Altoona, Florida Astor, Florida Brevard County, Florida Bushnell, Florida Clermont, Florida Cocoa Beach, Florida Daytona Beach, Florida DeLand, Florida Disston City, Florida Fort King, Florida Geneva, Florida Goldenrod, Florida Groveland, Florida Holly Hill, Florida Hontoon Island, DeLand, Florida Jacksonville, Florida Kissimmee, Florida Lake Apopka, Florida Lake County, Florida Lake Mary, Florida Marion County, Florida Merritt Island, Florida Miami, Florida Mims, Florida Mount Dora, Florida Newnans Lake, Gainesville, Florida New Smyrna, Florida New Smyrna Beach, Florida Ocala, Florida Ocklawaha River, Florida Orlando, Florida Ormond Beach, Florida Osceola County, Florida Sanford, Florida Silver Springs, Florida St. Augustine, Florida St. Cloud, Florida St. Johns River, Florida St. Petersburg, Florida Tampa, Florida Tavares, Florida Weirsdale, Florida Winter Garden, Florida Winter Park, Florida Ybor City, Tampa, Florida Rights Holder <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a> Contributing Project <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> External Reference "<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php. Moving Image A series of visual representations that, when shown in succession, impart an impression of motion. Original Format 1 podcast Duration 11 minutes and 36 seconds Compression 136kbps Producer Cassanello, Robert Director Clarke, Bob Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A History of Central Florida, Episode 39: Wartime Civil Defense Alternative Title Wartime Civil Defense Podcast Subject Podcasts Documentaries World War II, 1939-1945 Civil defense--Florida Description Episode 39 of A History of Central Florida Podcast: Wartime Civil Defense. RICHES Podcast Documentaries are short form narrative documentaries that explore Central Florida history and are locally produced. These podcasts can involve the participation or cooperation of local area partners. Episode 39 features a discussion of World War II-era civil defense training materials located at the Museum of Geneva History in Geneva. This podcast also includes interview with Dr. Mark Howard Long of the University of Central Florida, Central Florida local George "Speedy" Harrell, Mary Jo Martin of the Museum of Geneva History, and Dr. Gary Ross Mormino of the University of South Florida. Type Moving Image Source Original 11-minute and 36-second podcast by Bob Clarke, 2013: RICHES Podcast Documentaries, Orlando, Florida. <a href="http://youtu.be/SlTpnIlLeA4" target="_blank">http://youtu.be/SlTpnIlLeA4</a>. Requires <a href="http://www.apple.com/itunes/affiliates/download/" target="_blank">iTunes</a> Is Part Of <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a>, Orlando, Florida. <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/137" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida Collection</a>, RICHES Podcast Documentaries Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Coverage Museum of Geneva History, Geneva, Florida Creator Clarke, Bob Publisher <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a> Contributor Long, Mark Howard Harrell, George "Speedy" Martin, Mary Jo Mormino, Gary Ross Cassanello, Robert Gibson, Ella Hazen, Kendra Kelley, Katie Velásquez, Daniel <a href="http://www.usgennet.org/usa/fl/county/seminole/Geneva/museum.htm" target="_blank"> Museum of Geneva History</a> <a href="http://www.floridamemory.com/" target="_blank">Florida Memory Project</a> <a href="http://www.loc.gov/" target="_blank">Library of Congress</a> Date Created 2013 Date Issued 2015-01-11 Date Copyrighted 2015-01-11 Format application/website Medium 11-minute and 36-second podcast Language eng Mediator History Teacher Civics/Government Teacher Provenance Originally created by Bob Clarke and published by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a>. Rights Holder <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES </a> Accrual Method Item Creation Contributing Project <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> External Reference "<a href="http://youtu.be/SlTpnIlLeA4" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida, Episode 39: Wartime Civil Defense</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. Abrahamson, James L. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/10049744" target="_blank">The American Home Front: Revolutionary War, Civil War, World War I, World War II</a>. Fort Lesley J. McNair, Washington, DC: National Defense University Press, 1983. Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website) <a href="http://youtu.be/SlTpnIlLeA4" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida, Episode 39: Wartime Civil Defense</a> 1st Street 3rd Inceptor Command A History of Central Florida air raid warning siren aircraft Aircraft Warning Service airplane Aldeman, Helen American Legion, Inc. AP Associated Press Attack of Pearl Harbor AWS Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks Blanding, Albert H. BPOE Cees, Jay Civic Exhibition Center civil defense civilian civilian volunteer Civitan Club Clarke, Bob club Coates, Hope cold war College Club Elks Lodge Empire State Building Fenton, B. J. First Street Ford, Chip Fort Kent, Maine Fortune Magazine Frank, Walter Geneva German Germany Gibson, Ella Hannon, Barbara Harrell, George "Speedy" Hazen, Kendra homefront Japan Japanese Johnnie Walker Whisky Kelley, Katie Key West Kiwanis Club La Paz labor Lions Club Long, Mark Howard Martin, Mary Jo Messerschmitt Me 262 Meyers, Betty Mormino, Gary Ross Morrison Field Army Air Base Museum of Geneva History Nazi Nazi German New York City, New York Norton Gallery and School of Art observation station OCRHC Orange County Regional History Center Palm Beach Palm Beach Art League Pearl Harbor, Hawaii Pioneer Hall podcast RICHES Robb, Inex Robert Cassanello Rotary Club Soviet Soviet Union spotter spotters' neck State Defense Council of Florida Strain, Ralph Stumpf submarine Tallahassee Tampa The Palm Beach Post Third Inceptor Command Thomas, Tommy training training disc Tylander, Ray U-boat U.S. Air Corps U.S. Army U.S. Army Ground Observer Corps UCF University of Central Florida USAAC Velásquez, Daniel Walker, Johnnie war effort warship Witek, J. R. women World War II WWII https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/bbb0ae842ad6e72de73c9276c0dd813b.mp3 b866855cd9352138590d10fae92c3caa https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/8f38523892d260024f1c6b52fb61cb8e.pdf 28d06349d57059dc0679914dc7d67591 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens Collection Alternative Title Polasek Collection Subject Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens Winter Park (Fla.) Art--Southern States Artists--Florida Contributor <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a> Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/34" target="_blank">Winter Park Collection</a>, Orange County Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Language eng Type Collection Coverage Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens, Winter Park, Florida Accrual Method Donation Rights Holder Copyright to these resources is held by the <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a> and is provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a> External Reference "<a href="http://www.polasek.org/about/" target="_blank">ABOUT</a>." Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens. http://www.polasek.org/about/. Description The Albin Polasek Museum and Sculpture Gardens, located at 633 Osceola Avenue in Winter Park, Florida. Albin Polasek, known internationally for his sculptures, retired to Lake Osceola in Winter Park in 1950. The same year that he had moved to Florida, Polasek suffered from a stroke, which paralyzed the right side of his body. Seven months later, he married one of his former students, Ruth Sherwood, who died just two years later. Despite being confined to a wheelchair, Polasek was able to create 18 major works in his later years. In 1961, he married Emily Muska Kubat and the set up the Albin Polasek Foundation, opening up the Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens, located in parts of Polasek's home and studio, which featured his personal galleries, chapel, and gardens. On May 19, 1965, Polasek passed away and was buried beside his first wife at Palm Cemetery. Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer Parke, Erin Interviewee McIntosh, Hal Original Format 1 audio recording Duration 1 hour, 6 minutes, and 42 seconds Bit Rate/Frequency 128kbps Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Art Legends of Orange County: The Art of Hal McIntosh Alternative Title Oral History, McIntosh Subject Oral history--United States Winter Park (Fla.) Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens Art--Southern States Artists--Florida Painters--Southern States Painting--Florida Hopper, Edward, 1882-1967 Education--Florida Teachers--Florida Educators--Florida Polasek, Albin, 1879-1965 Naples (Fla.) Maitland (Fla.) Description Oral history of Hal McIntosh, conducted by Erin Parke on March 16, 2015. McIntosh is a nationally renowned artist who currently resides in Winter Park, Florida. Born in 1927, Hal McIntosh began his formal studies at the Detroit Art Institute in Detroit, Michigan, and the Toledo Museum of Art in Toledo, Ohio. At age 18, the Art Research Studio (present-day Maitland Art Center) in Maitland, Florida, selected him as the institution’s youngest-ever artist in residence. His talent later earned him the Directorship of the Academy of Fine Arts in Lynchburg, Virginia, where he served as a museum director and teacher for five years. As a resident of Central Florida, McIntosh taught at the Loch Haven Art Center in Orlando and even ran his own institution known as the McIntosh School in Winter Park for 30 years. McIntosh splits his time between his Cape Cod, Massachusetts, and Winter Park studios. With an artistic career lasting over 60 years, Hal McIntosh’s influence on our community is profound. His bold abstractions, tranquil waterscapes, and stirring portraiture, all masterfully painted with a touch of McIntosh’s signature Orientalism, have been widely exhibited in the area and are part of numerous regional collections, both private and public. Deep connections with the people and places of Orange County have allowed McIntosh to join the ranks as one of the greats and to be remembered eternally as an Art Legend. In this oral history interview, McIntosh discusses his early life and education, his teaching philosophy, and where he gets the inspiration and influence for his art. He also mentions his relationship with Albin Polasek and Emily Muska Kubat Polasek. Eric Varty, a close friend of Hal, also contributes briefly to the conversation. Table Of Contents 0:00:00 Introduction 0:03:01 Life as an artist 0:09:16 Galleries in Winter Park 0:14:35 Galleries in Naples 0:22:58 Galleries in Cape Cod, Massachusetts 0:25:30 Edward Hopper 0:29:11 Teaching philosophy 0:38:12 Audience perception 0:41:03 Inspiration 0:47:12 Winter Park Arts Festival and commission 0:54:27 Albin Polasek and Emily Muska Kubat Polasek 1:03:54 Maitland Research Studio and Jules Andre Smith 1:06:29 Closing remarks Creator McIntosh, Hal Parke, Erin Source Original 1-hour, 6-minute, and 42-second oral history: McIntosh, Hal. Interviewed by Erin Parke on March 16, 2015. <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a>, Winter Park, Florida. Date Created 2015-03-16 Date Copyrighted 2015-03-16 Date Modified 2015-06-09 Has Format 50-page digital transcript of original 1-hour, 6-minute, and 42-second oral history: McIntosh, Hal. Interviewed by Erin Parke on March 16, 2015. <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a>, Winter Park, Florida. Is Part Of <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a>, Winter Park, Florida.<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/admin/collections/show/id/152" target="_blank"> </a> <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/admin/collections/show/id/152" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens Collection</a>, Winter Park Collection, Orange County Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Requires <a href="http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/" target="_blank"> Adobe Flash Player</a> <a href="http://java.com/en/download/index.jsp" target="_blank">Java</a> <a href="http://www.adobe.com/products/reader.html" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a> Format audio/mp3 application/pdf Extent 61 MB 288 KB Medium 1-hour, 6-minute, and 42-second audio recording 50-page digital transcript Language eng Type Sound Coverage Provincetown, Cape Cod, Massachusetts Winter Park, Florida Naples, Florida Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens, Winter Park, Florida Research Studio, Maitland, Florida Accrual Method Donation Mediator History Teacher Geography Teacher Humanities Teacher Visual Arts Teacher Provenance Originally created by Hal McIntosh and Erin Parke. Rights Holder Copyright to this resource is held by the <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a> and is provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://www.polasek.org/" target="_blank">Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens</a> External Reference "<a href="http://www.paintingsbymcintosh.com/mbr_bio.php" target="_blank">Paintings By McIntosh: CV/Bio</a>." Paintings By McIntosh. http://www.paintingsbymcintosh.com/mbr_bio.php. Bishop, Philip E. "<a href="http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2005-02-15/news/0502140273_1_mcintosh-koi-painting" target="_blank">Winter Park Artist Mcintosh Spices Life With Variety</a>." The Orlando Sentinel, February 15, 2005. http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2005-02-15/news/0502140273_1_mcintosh-koi-painting. Hummel, Terry. "<a href="http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-11-03/entertainment/os-hummel-art-events-orlando-20111103_1_area-artists-artists-share-art-galleries" target="_blank">A must-see show in Eustis: Lake Eustis Museum of Art shows works by Hal McIntosh, Maury Hurt, Bill Orr</a>." The Orlando Sentinel, November 3, 2011. http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-11-03/entertainment/os-hummel-art-events-orlando-20111103_1_area-artists-artists-share-art-galleries. Transcript Parke Alright. Good morning. Um, my name is Erin Parke and today I will be interviewing Mr. Hal McIntosh. Today is, uh, March 16th, 2015, and—alright. Um, Hal, can you tell me a little bit about like your early life? Where you grew up, um, if you had brothers and sisters, anything like that? McIntosh Well, I grew up in—in Detroit, Michigan, and, uh, I had, uh, uh, older brother—two older brothers and an older sister. I was the… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Baby of the... Parke Baby. McIntosh Family, and, uh, apparently, my art interest started very early. Parke Nice. McIntosh My, uh, mother said that, when I was five, I was doing caricatures Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Of my little friends. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh She could recognize who they were. Parke Oh, that’s amazing. McIntosh I was five years old, and as the years went by—my early years—really early years—my parents didn’t try to rush me into… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Arts, uh, teachers… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Or anything like that. They just saw that I had any materials that I needed, but, uh, they never tried to force me to study, you know, when I was young. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh They just let me alone because that was the only thing I wanted to do… Parke Yeah. McIntosh As a kid. Parke [clears throat]. McIntosh And, uh—so, uh, I was fortunate, in that respect. A lot of the parents that I’ve talked to in later years that had, uh, children that are… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Artistic, and they say, “Oh, what am I going to do? I’ve gotta…” Parke Yep. McIntosh “Send them somewhere to study.” I said… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “Well,” you know, “Don’t rush them into—don’t overdo your…” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “You’re pushing them, because that’ll turn them right off., uh, just be—do what you can.” Parke Yeah. McIntosh “Cooperate, but don’t make a big deal out of it.” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And if they’re really gonna do something in their lifetime—what—whatever… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Uh… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Kind of, uh, occ—occupation… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh They might end up, sometimes those interests—interests start when kids are very young. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Sometimes you don’t—you might have a… Parke Find out later on… McIntosh [inaudible] degree in engineering, and—and you end up, uh, doing something… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Totally different [laughs]. Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh I was, uh, fortunate enough to know all my life what I wanted to do. Parke That’s amazing, and it’s nice that your family was so supportive. That’s great. McIntosh Well… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh They were supportive by not… Parke By not pushing you. McIntosh Pushing. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh,these hysterical mothers that… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] I’d seen in the past, uh… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh That, you know, come to me for advice, because their[sic] child is doing some drawings, and—“What’ll I do? What’ll I do?” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Leave ‘em alone [laughs]. Parke Yeah, so you’ve been able to make your living as an artist, uh, essentially your whole life, and that’s extremely amazing and very significant. Um, how has that been for you? McIntosh Well, it’s a very difficult, uh… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Situation. When you’re an artist, there’s—there’s not a lot of jobs sitting around waiting for you. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, I was very fortunate, uh, in the years that I was at Rollins [College], uh, as a temporary student… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Years ago, of course, and, uh, the brother of one of this[sic] Rollins students was an artist that[sic] I met who lived in Silver Springs[, Florida]. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, I was, at that point—later on—had a master’s degree from the University of Michigan—teaching there. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And what do you do… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh You know? You don’t walk out with those credentials… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And walk into a job. Nobody’s awaiting for you. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And, uh, this friend had some really nice portraits of—that he had stacked on the floor… Parke Hm. McIntosh Against the wall. He was a landscape painter, and I said, “I didn’t know you did portraits,” and he said, “Well, I started with Jerry Farnsworth on Cape Cod[, Massachusetts].” He’s quite a prominent… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh American portrait painter, and he said—he said, “Why don’t you, uh, write Jerry Farnsworth and see if you can get a job as his assistant.” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “Learn how to do really commercial portraits, and, uh, that way you might be able to make a living…” Parke Yeah. McIntosh “To start out with,” and I did so, and… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, was accepted with my credentials. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, didn’t even have a car… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh At that time [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh I got off the bus in North Truro, Massachusetts, and was directed how to walk to the professor’s house, and, uh, Jerry Farnsworth and Helen Sawyer were, uh, uh, married, and she was a well-known, uh, artist. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And taught in the school, and, uh, this was basically, uh, a school, uh—portraiture school. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Minor landscape work—‘cause she taught and he taught the, uh—the, uh, portrait work. I was with him for five years. Parke Wow. McIntosh He had another school in Sarasota[, Florida]. Parke Okay. McIntosh Uh, and, uh, Siesta Key[, Florida] [inaudible]. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, uh, I was down there during the winter. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I worked in a hotel. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh I was busboy, waiter… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Several other jobs—a hotel on the beach—and went to school and taught with him in—in mornings, and that exposure, uh, through five years… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh With him really… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Got me so I was able to make some money doing portraits. Parke Nice. McIntosh And I had, uh—uh, this hotel I was working in part-time, after the morning school sessions, someone saw my work there and recommended me—unknown to myself, uh… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh To the board of directors of, uh, an art museum… Parke Wow. McIntosh Up in Virginia. Parke Mmhmm [clears throat]. McIntosh And later on, I was accepted, became director of the museum there for five years, but, uh, those accidental things that happen. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You know? You meet someone… Parke Yep. McIntosh Who’s done portraits, and, uh—for three years, I did portraits, uh, in Provincetown, Massachusetts… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, on the street… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Let’s say, uh, I had a studio… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh In a building that was on—right on the Commercial Street there, but at night, I had a display outside and people would book portrait[sic] for their children and stuff. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Pastel portraits, uh, done for $10… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, in a matte and in a bag in 45 minutes. Uh… Parke That’s so quick [laughs]. McIntosh [inaudible]. It was—it was a shock to get—to have to start that kind of a routine… Parke Yeah. McIntosh But I got used to it, and… Parke [clears throat]. McIntosh Uh,I did six to eight portraits a day… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh For the whole summer, ‘cause I had summers off, uh, from teaching, and, uh, that led—all those portraits I did—hundreds of them… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Literally, I, uh—for three years. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Eight—eight days a week—seven days a week. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, so I had a—a record of lots of portraits in my… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Career. Now, those $10 [laughs] portraits… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Would be $60 [laughs] portraits. Parke Yeah, exactly. McIntosh [inaudible] at the time, but believe it or not, I bought my beach house on Cape Cod… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh With the money from—just from those… Parke Wow. McIntosh $10 portraits. Parke Wow. McIntosh And, uh, as I was saving all that money… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh In cash, uh, in a safe deposit box to go to Japan. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And this house came up for sale on Cape Cod on the beach, and I opted to buy this house… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh With that money, and I got to Japan later on in years. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, had a wonderful experience in Japan, which is another story. Parke [laughs] So I know that you have a true love for Cape Cod. Um, what drew you here to Winter Park[, Florida]? McIntosh Uh, my, uh—that’s a story that starts in Sanford[, Florida]. My sister and her husband were stationed—he was stationed in Sanford at the… Parke Okay. McIntosh Navy base there, at that time. Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh And, uh, I came down for part of my high school and lived with them in Sanford. Uh, they had an old house on the lake, right opposite the airport… Parke Okay. McIntosh So the planes were taking off… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Over the house, and, uh, uh, they decided, after, uh, he left the Navy, uh, to stay Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, in Florida, because their son was, uh, a young son… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And was doing better health-wise in Florida… Parke Okay. McIntosh For some reason. I don’t know what… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But they decided to stay here. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And, uh, he, uh—they had a house and[?]—rented a house, right on the highway in[?]—across from Lily Lake… Parke Okay. McIntosh In, uh—in Winter Park. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Anyhow, uh, families tend to… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Follow families. Parke Yes, they do. McIntosh And, eventually, my parents… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Moved down to Florida, because… Parke Okay. McIntosh My sister and her husband were… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Settled there, and, uh, later on, my brother—older brother—moved to Florida, and, uh, my other brother moved to Florida. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs]. Parke So it was just gradual process. McIntosh Uh, so that’s a story that people in Florida that[sic] are Yankees basically, uh, “wash ashore,” as they used to call it… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh On Cape Cod [laughs]. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, they follow one another, you know? Parke Mmhmm, yeah. McIntosh It just happened at different time periods. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And I’d go back and forth when—when I was in college… Parke Yeah. McIntosh To, uh, my parents’ house, and, uh—so we all ended up here [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs]. And I stayed at it, and—oh, Winter Park has been very good to me. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I had wonderful exposure on Park Avenue for many, many years Parke Yeah. McIntosh Which a lot of artists didn’t have that, uh—that lot that the, uh, uh, wonderful, old Golden Cricket Shop had a gallery… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Right in front of the shop that was all mine… Parke Oh, wow. McIntosh For years. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh So I had like 10 paintings Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In the gallery, and a painting in the window, but it was a gift shop… Parke Okay. McIntosh That I had that exposure to the sidewalk with—with one major painting Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And people would come in and buy… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Or see paintings there for a number of years, and, uh, right after that, I was with Center Street Gallery, who actually, uh—uh, I think they owned the property that the Cricket… Parke Okay. McIntosh Was—the Golden Cricket was on, and Hugh McCain and Je—Jeanette Genius [McKean] were friends, and—and Mr. McCain was one of my part-time professors at Rollins. Parke Oh, nice. McIntosh How they ever let me in… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Rollins? I don’t… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh I don’t know, but, uh, I was only doing art… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Art there, but then, I had exposure at the Center Street Gallery, which was actually ended up right next door… Parke Nice. McIntosh To the Golden Cricket. Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh And an almost [inaudible]—almost war situation. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Between the two of them, and, uh, after long years at Center Street Gallery and a number of shows there, uh, I went with, uh, Solarte, which was a—a shop down the avenue, uh, owned by a French gentleman and his family, and had my—I had a big show there… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And had my work on display there for several years, uh, which was another exposure on Park… Parke Mmhmm, yeah. McIntosh Avenue, and I—I lucked into things like that, but, uh… Varty Miller Gallery. McIntosh Oh, well, Miller Gallery. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] I was with them, but they weren’t getting the kind of support from the community Parke Hm. McIntosh Winter Park was—and maybe still is—a little difficult in—for a gallery. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Really, I don’t know why, because Winter Park people have plenty of money… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But, uh, Miller Gallery stayed only for a year or so. Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh They just weren’t… Parke It just wasn’t making it. McIntosh Making the sales. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And they left, so I don’t consider, you know, that a long association with them. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But, uh… Varty Naples[, Florida]. McIntosh Well, Naples, [laughs] yes. Parke [laughs]. Varty [laughs]. McIntosh I had careers [laughs] in this—I don’t know whether this leads directly into Naples, but, uh… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Friends of mine, uh, on Cape Cod had a gallery, where my work was exhibited, and they were both professors, uh, in Boston[, Massachusetts]. Parke Okay. McIntosh At, uh, universities there and such[?], and, uh, they did the gallery work in the summertime, and had a beautiful gallery—one of prettiest ones on that end… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Of Cape Cod, and after a few years of success in that gallery, I had several shows there. Uh, they decided to, uh, give up the teaching, made a decision… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And the gallery was doing so well, they decided to have a second gallery in Florida, and, uh, I met them in Florida, and they were in Sarasota, at that time, and they were looking there, and they—both close friends of mine, as well as handling my work… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, they kept—when[?] we were in Sarasota, they kept talking about Naples, and I said, “We’re sitting in Sarasota and you’re talking about Naples. Let’s go to Naples.” Parke [laughs] It’s not far from there [laughs]. McIntosh And they wanted my advice and stuff. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And so we all went to Naples, and they ended up renting, uh, uh, space in the nicest part of Naples downtown… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, it was only a couple of years. They were so successful. Basically, the only really good gallery in Naples, at that time. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Now there are probably a hundred galleries… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In Naples [laughs], uh, but as the years—few years—went by, they, uh, built a gallery on, uh, Fifth[?] Street—I don’t know what. The Naples Art Gallery—elegant, gorgeous, gallery. Parke Nice. McIntosh Big gallery. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And, uh, shows, uh, really top artists. Parke Mmhmm. McIntos And, uh, it was the—probably one of the prettiest galleries in the country. Parke Wow. McIntosh From outside and from inside. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh It had mostly paintings, but they also—part of the gallery was elegant gifts, uh… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And antique, uh—oriental antiques… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh In a—just a side gallery, uh, but they were there for years. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And most successful. Parke That’s nice. McIntosh And I had 24 one-man shows there. Parke Just there? How many have you had in total again? McIntosh 35 [laughs]. Parke That’s awesome [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, but, uh, these shows were, uh, something else. Parke Yeah. McIntosh They—actually, a one-man show only ran for a week… Parke Okay. McIntosh Which is unusual. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, people were allowed to watch them hang the show on Saturday. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And they didn’t—people did come. They wanted to see what was coming up, and whether they wanted to go to the opening on Sunday [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And they weren’t allowed to buy anything… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, which is unusual. Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, they wouldn’t let somebody buy something that was supposed to go in the show that would not be in the show. Parke Okay. McIntosh So Sunday night—are—are we getting close to the end here? You’re looking at… Parke I’m trying—I’m just making sure that it’s picking everything up. McIntosh Oh. Parke Sorry [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] Yeah, so the openings were Sunday night and this is a… Parke Yeah. McIntosh This is a riot. Naples is very elegant. I had special clothes to wear when I had my openings, because, you know, you don’t wear pink sport coats in… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In Winter Park. Naples is very formal, but very… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Resort-y and very rich. Varty Bizarre [laughs]. McIntosh What? [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh He—he can’t stop talking. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And, uh… Varty Sorry. McIntosh The, uh—on Sunday night, people, at six o’clock… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Would line up to come into the gallery, and the doors would not open till six, and here we go again. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh As they came in—sometimes in formal clothes, because they were going out separate[?]. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, as they came in, they were not allowed to buy a painting. Parke Hm. McIntosh They could look for a half an hour, and, uh, at the end of a half an hour, they could make a bid on the painting and… Parke Okay. McIntosh So the wife—they—they would come in and they’d quickly [inaudible]. Parke They’d find one that they loved. McIntosh Yeah. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh They’d see. Then on Saturday… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh So they already knew there was one they loved[?]. So the wife would park her husband… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In front of the painting, and he would just stand in front of the painting with his arms folded blocking the painting. Parke Oh, my goodness. McIntosh So that the other Naples folks knew that they… Parke That that was taken. McIntosh So at 6:35, they would[?]—[inaudible] this—the—the wife would say, “We have that one.” Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And—but they didn’t want, uh, people to presell from seeing the work… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh The day before or whatever—week before—and, uh, they wanted everybody that[sic] was coming to the show basically to… Parke Yeah. McIntosh To be able to buy a painting. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, so consequently, uh, the sales were almost always right in the first couple of days… Parke Yeah. McIntosh For the opening night, and, uh, rest of the week some of them would be out on their yachts… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And stuff, so they didn’t want to miss these shows… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh If they looked important, and so I basically made my living, uh, in—in, uh, one week out of the year. Parke That[sic] amazing. McIntosh At a Naples show. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, and if it rained on the opening night, uh, that—that put a damper on sales. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But, uh, it worked out 24 times Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] So… Parke That’s great. McIntosh And, uh, the gallery truly—well, it just—you’ll see the picture of it. Parke Yeah. McIntosh It was, uh, probably one of the prettiest galleries… Parke Extravagant. McIntosh In the country. Very, very beautiful. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh These guys had good taste. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And, uh, they handled [inaudible] Glass[?]. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Um, a lot of well-known painters from California and other parts of the country. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And[?], uh, I actually—I’ve always been interested in antiques. I bought antiques in Winter Park for them to put in their gallery. Parke Okay. McIntosh In their sales gallery—antique area there, and, uh, they didn’t have time… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh To scout antiques. Parke Yeah. McIntosh I loved scouting antiques [laughs]. Parke That’s nice. McIntosh So I would buy stuff for them, and—and they would se—sell it at the gallery… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh For 10 times what I got. Parke Yeah. McIntosh I was getting good bargains… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh From dealers here in Winter Park and elsewhere. Uh… Varty Don’t forget the Blue Heron Gallery and the Cove Gallery. McIntosh Well, I know those were galleries on Cape Cod. I’m not going to forget them, but, uh, I exhibited at the Blue Heron Gallery and another top gallery on Cape Cod… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh For many years. Before that, the Cove Gallery., uh, so I had those two galleries on Cape Cod. Parke So you’ve been all over [laughs]. McIntosh Well, you’ve gotta—when you’re painting every day… Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, you know, you need the exposure, and, um, just ended up being on Cape Cod, for, today, it’s six months of the year. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh At Cape Cod., uh, when I was teaching, we had shorter summers, but, uh, now, it’s half here half on Cape Cod. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Cape Cod is a fabulous place for artists. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, the light is gorgeous there for painting, and the portrait studio there, on a gray day, the light was absolutely… Parke Oh. McIntosh Gorgeous on—on the models on a gray day. Park [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, uh, very cool light. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Florida has that hot light. Parke Yes [laughs]. McIntosh [inaudible]. Parke It does. McIntosh Well, [inaudible] it’s not just the heat it’s a harsher light… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh For a painter than Cape Cod. That’s why Cape Cod has many, many artists. Parke Okay. That’s interesting. McIntosh It’s in[?] the, uh—the, uh, most famous American painter today. Eric? [laughs]. Varty Yes. Edward Hopper? McIntosh Yeah [laughs]. Varty [inaudible]? McIntosh Uh… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Not… Varty Uh, [inaudible]? McIntosh Not Miligrove[?]. Probably the most famous… Varty Uh… McIntosh Uh, American painter… Varty [inaudible]? McIntosh Of—of all time… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Is, uh, Robert, uh [laughs]—Eric? Varty Who? McIntosh [laughs] Who’s the person you—what was the first name? Varty Oh, Edward Hopper. McIntosh [laughs] I’m talking and I’m forgetting as fast as I can[?]. Varty You could see Edward Hopper’s house… McIntosh Yeah. Varty From Hal’s house on the Cape. Parke Oh, wow. McIntosh Yeah Parke That’s awesome [laughs]. McIntosh And I knew Edward Hopper through the Farnsworth’s [inaudible] school. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I went to, uh, cocktail parties with him. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And one time Jerry Farnsworth said that, “We’re going to this party and Edward Hopper will be there, but, uh, you’ll—I’ll introduce you to him, but don’t expect him to say much…” Parke [laughs]. McIntosh “Because he doesn’t—isn’t a big talker,” and, uh, I did meet him that night, and, uh, he was a very polite listener and wonderful. Very imposing… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Tall gentleman, but I could see their house from… Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh Down the beach on the cliff from my house, and anyhow, uh, I wasn’t a close friend of Edward Hopper’s, but we were close enough. Uh, we sat in a Christian Union Church, when they had these flea market sales of clothes and china… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And stuff, and his wife<a title="">[1]</a> and Mrs. Farnsworth were trying on… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Cheap clothing, blouses and suits… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And coats, and… Varty Uh… McIntosh Step, uh… Varty [inaudible]. McIntosh No [laughs]. They would—we would… Varty Mrs. Farnsworth was Helen Sawyer. McIntosh I’ve already made that clear. Varty Oh, okay. Reference her at the Morse Museum of American Art. McIntosh Okay. Uh, Helen Sawyer is Mrs. Farnsworth. Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh And is recognized in major museums… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh As well as Farnsworth was. Both of those, uh, couples—Farnsworth and Hopper—were both, uh, active during the [Great] Depression. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And they were frugal. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Farnsworth had a garden where they grew their own vegetables, so they wouldn’t go to the grocery store except to buy meat Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But they grew everything else, and they were used to—during the Depression, Jerry Farnsworth, a famous portrait painter, would make clothes out of old, uh, bags Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Flour bags that they used to have patterns on the big bags of—of flour for his wife Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And very frugal [laughs]. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And that’s why those two wives were trying on cheap clothes at the church … Parke ‘Cause that’s what they always knew. McIntosh Sale. Well, they just, you know, uh—they weren’t shoppers. [inaudible] [laughs]. Eh, uh, Eric and I would say, uh, [laughs] he—Hopper—Edward and I sat there and he would just shake his head Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Every time they came out in one of these outfits. You know, outfits for two dollars [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But here’s—at that time, he was a well-known painter. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, extremely well-known.Now he’s considered one of the top American painters Parke Mmhmm, yeah. McIntosh Period. Uh, [clears throat] a wonderful, wonderful man. Parke Yeah. McIntosh His—his wife did all the talking. Parke [laughs] Always. McIntosh [laughs] I find[?] out—found out why he’s so quiet, because… Parke ‘Cause he has a wife to make up for it [laughs]. McIntosh She—she talked all the time [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh That’s probably why Edward was fairly silent, but, uh—a big tall man. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Very imposing man, and, uh his work is—is fabulous. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Fabulous. Really [inaudible]. Parke It’s beautiful. Um, can you tell me a little about your teaching philosophy? I know teaching was a big part of your life. McIntosh Oh, absolutely. I’ve taught for over 40—40 years [clears throat], and, uh, I think my philosophy is—basically, in teaching—is how to teach the students how to see Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, people don’t see like artists, and, uh, it takes a long time to get them to that point. I also wanted them, uh, to end, uh, up being taught and being brought out as individual painter, not as a [inaudible]. Parke As a cookie-cutter… McIntosh Well… Parke Standard. McIntosh Not—not the [inaudible]—cookie-cutter. So many students and many of my early students wanted to study with me, because they wanted to paint like me, and I went through two schools with Farnsworth. Later on, Bassford School, where they taught only their style, and the students were painting as much as they could like the teacher. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh My philosophy was that I would expose my students to different techniques. Every couple of weeks, they would have a new project. This week we’re, uh—do an abstract. Uh, next week we’re gonna do this and this, uh, but it—it shocked them, because they Parke [laughs]. McIntosh You know, they had to start thinking differently Parke Yeah. McIntosh Because these were specific, uh, instructions that we’re gonna go in this direction… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Art-wise, uh, and I would find [clears throat] after a long time—I had students for years. Some of them by being exposed to different techniques and presentations of art, I would find one person, suddenly, would just glow when they—you know, because they… Parke They found what they were supposed to do [clears throat]. McIntosh Found what they loved Parke Yeah. McIntosh And I would say, “Okay, Mrs. so-and-so or Mr. so-and-so, you’re gonna stay…” Parke [laughs]. McIntosh “With this technique as long as you can.” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “Forever, if possible.” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “We’re going to keep trying stuff,” and as—as I kept students for a long time. They—they loved my classes, and in spite of the fact they were in shock when I had to expose them to different… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Techniques, but eventually, all ended up with their own… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Style, and that’s the biggest service you can do to a student—is find them and what’s in them. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Teach them how to see. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I had—students would come to me, practically in tears… Parke Oh. McIntosh After a couple years studying. They’d say, “I—finally, I know what you meant when you said, ‘You’ve gotta learn to see.’ I see things so much differently.” uh, I’m visual. Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh All my life, I’ve been visual. Uh, I could turn my head and see subject matter around me anywhere or in the gutter. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh You know, I would—I’d tell them, “Look down,” you know, “Look at the cement. There might be something there…” Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh “That’s beautiful. Uh, look—look at that garbage can.” You know, there’s beauty everywhere. Parke That’s a remarkable skill to have [laughs]. McIntosh Well—but I had severe exposure in the portrait school… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh To the particular style, uh, that I was learning, uh, because he taught only his style. After that, you’re—in time, you go to your own style. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh There’s a long delay, if you have been with one teacher the long time. You’re only doing… Parke Yeah. McIntosh His style work, and a lot of artists do the same, uh, basic work[?] their whole lifetime. People don’t recognize work—my work sometimes, ‘cause one day I’ll do an abstract and the next day I’ll do a floral, uh… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh You know, I love changing from one to another. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I don’t consider, uh, abstracts any different than… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Realistic paintings. Uh, every painting starts out as an abstraction, and, uh, they’re—you know, a painting’s a painting. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And, uh, the art world has expanded so much now that it’s gone way beyond painting. It’s in constructions and light shows and huge presentations and… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Sculptures and other things, you know? It’s very complex now, but, uh, as far as the painting world goes, uh, I was just—get energy from doing different things. Parke Yeah. McIntosh It energizes me, and, uh, uh, I have ideas now, you know, that I could never get to… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh I’m sure [laughs], but I’m still clipping things out of magazines that I like and, uh, just keeping stuff for… Parke Yeah. McIntosh You know, paintings that I’m exposed to—to, uh, [inaudible] that I admire. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Um, but, um, you should talk to some of my old students that[sic]… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh They’re old like I am [laughs], you know, uh, and they’re having big shows. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Lot of my students, uh, went right on professional work, and work—are making prices higher—higher than mine [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, they all had their own look, eventually. That’s why I kept students so long… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Because, uh, they just wanted that assurance, and they—still got exposed to a lot of, uh, unusual approaches, but, uh, a core of about 30 students stayed with me for years. Parke Wow. McIntosh And, uh, I’ve done portraits with a number of my students… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh In the past. I had been commissioned to do portrait, a really lovely lady from, uh, Tavares area up there, and, uh, uh, she had me over to do a—to talk about a portrait, and she said, uh—I realized right away there was something, uh—she had a problem. She’d had a stroke, and she didn’t like the photographs that were being taken of her to present to friends and family and all that stuff. She was getting on and she was very concerned about facial, uh, problems, and, uh, she was still a beautiful lady Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But you could tell she couldn’t sit for a portrait for a long period of time, but, uh, I took some photographs of her, we had lunch a couple times and talked ,and I did a large major portrait of her, uh, that nobody would recognize Parke [laughs]. McIntosh That there was a distortion in her face [laughs]. She loved it. Parke Aw. McIntosh And, uh, her family loved it. She wanted to leave a heritage [inaudible]. Parke Of course. McIntosh Uh, and it was a challenge for her, because she didn’t want to be photographed, and, uh, she had dedicated caretakers and stuff—wanted a picture of her and stuff, but, uh, it happened to be quite a nice portrait Parke Yeah. McIntosh But I knew her for so many years… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh That I knew how to eliminate those problems, and I know her, but you don’t often get challenges like that. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh It was a major challenge for me, but in every portrait is a major challenge, because you, uh—you really want to get the essence of the person, as well as the outward visual quality of them, and, uh… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You have to get something a little deeper than… Parke Yeah, is that kinda what you want people to get when they look at your art? That there is something—like, what do you want people to take away from your art, would you say? McIntosh Uh, whatever they want. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] Uh, I’ve been—I’ve been pleased to have, uh, letters from people that[sic] hated abstract art, and, uh, they see some of my abstracts, and they—they thank me for… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh This is possibly through my nephew, and his dental office has a number of my paintings, and… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, abstracts and realistic ones. Parke [clears throat]. McIntosh And they spend time there and they see abstract there[?]. Uh, they finally say, “Well, I guess that’s alright stuff.” Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, there’s a lot of people—just close their minds to abstract and other radical approaches to art, and it’s all the same. It’s, you know—I minored in sculpture. I would just be happy as ever to go back to sculpture … Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And do nothing else, but, uh, it’s a little hard to combine the two, uh, careers, because, uh, [inaudible] sculpture is messy. Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] It’s messier than painting, and, uh, my sculpture—I had my sculpture from Michigan, uh—minored in sculpture at the University of Michigan—and, uh, my work there—the pieces went into a gallery, uh, out of town. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And the gallery owner skipped the country, sold the work, kept all the money and never paid his artists, so I [laughs] never got my… Parke Oh. McIntosh Sculpture back, and I never… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Got any money from ‘em[?], but that was a wild, uh, [laughs] chase there. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] Uh, I’ve done murals. I did a mural at the University of Michigan that was about 60 feet long. Parke Wow. McIntosh And I’ve done major mu—murals. I did a major mural in a restaurant, and, you know… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Shoe store [laughs] or… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [inaudible], shoe store. Uh, did—I did some window display of[?] back[?], piddled in a lot of minor… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Careers. Stuff like that, uh, but, uh, it’s all tied up with art… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You know, but, uh… Parke What do you think inspires you to create? McIntosh What inspired me? Parke Mmhmm, sounds like a lot of different things [laughs]. McIntosh Well, my vision, I guess. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, I’m inspired by a lot of artists. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, each—each for a different reason. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, I can’t minimize that Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, I just see stuff and, uh, it excites me. I say, It would be wonderful to paint that. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I still have that, uh—I’m not able to paint eight hours a day, and never did. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But I paint mostly in the afternoons, most of my life. Uh, do the laundry in the morning [laughs]… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, in my teaching career I had to teach and paint also. So, uh, when my students were finished for the week, I got my studio back… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh ’Cause we both had the same studio, but, um, I—I get excited to be sitting where we are here, uh, seeing birds and animals and trees and flowers and all that stuff. Uh, I just—I just see things, and I’m, uh, fortunate in, uh—if I have photographs of things… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I can’t see again. Uh, I painted outside for years. Uh, as I got—you know, later on in my career, I did everything in the studio and worked from, uh, reference material. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, tons of reference material. Like an illustrator… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Has tons of… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Material to work from, but, uh, my paintings got large, and if you’re painting outside in the wind… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And the—you know, the painting is flopping… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In the wind, and, uh, also, uh, I find that painting outside quite often, uh—when you get the painting inside you see that the colors are difficult to… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Being out in the hot sun. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, transferring that, uh, you know—it’s not as good when you get it inside… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh So—and, uh—but I think you have to paint from life outside, and from portraits, you have to paint from life to learn how to paint without the sitter or without being in front of the subject. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Because your, uh, inventiveness comes out when you’re isolated in your studio. Parke Yeah. McIntosh You may have started something out. I’m working on an abstract now, and, uh, just as a joke I’m—when it gets in the show, I’m gonna call it Two Horses, and it’s an abstract painting. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But if you’ll look—I mean, before you leave there [coughs]—two Chinese, wooden horses in my apartment here. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I was painting them on Cape Cod. [inaudible] was painting of both of those horses, and I just got, eh—I wasn’t getting the way I wanted to. so I started scribbling them out with other colors, and underneath is the[?] abstraction—or[?] is the painting of these two horses, but, uh, when it doesn’t work, you know it, and you say, Well, I gotta go on, and to paint the canvas white—to get rid of the two horses—is a shame, because there’s color there… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And there’s[sic] shapes there, and do your new painting into that, leaving some of the—you can’t recognize anything about… Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh The horses, but, uh, that’s where the painting start out. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh If it were ever, uh, X-rayed [coughs]—my voice is so weak from my breathing problems, uh, but I’m sure it comes out… Parke Oh, yeah. McIntosh In your machine. Parke It’ll show up well. McIntosh But, uh, [clears throat], uh, if they ever X-rayed [laughs] that painting… Parke Then you would… McIntosh You would see… Parke See it [laughs]. McIntosh The horses there, and, uh—but other abstracts just paint themselves. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But, uh, once you get something down on a canvas—I don’t care what it is—just a splash of blue out—out of the blue—the—the rest of the work you’re painting into that piece—it’s a—it’s a piece of the puzzle. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh It may have nothing to do with… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh The final painting but, uh, you know, there’s a lot more in a painting than people know. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Because they don’t see the progression of it. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And that’s why, uh, it, uh—I men—wanna mention these TV shows with artists, because most artists don’t consider those people… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Artists [laughs]. I don’t[?]—cancel that… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] Uh, but anyhow, it’s—it’s—it’s a wonderful career. Parke Good. McIntosh nd the—you saw some of my acting photographs there? [laughs]. Parke That was wonderful [laughs]. McIntosh Well, done a little bit of that, but, uh… Varty Winter Park Arts Festival also. Parke Yeah, um, the Winter Park Arts Festival—you were kind of a founding member of that. That’s a big deal. McIntosh Yes. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And I lived just down the street from the festival. Uh, I lived across the street from the Langford Hotel… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Which is gone now, Uh, and—and I mentioned that was my Japanese house, which was quite a—a notable thing in Winter Park, because there weren’t any Japanese houses here, and I had been to Japan, and, uh, had a house fire, and remodeled the whole place in Japanese style… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh After my visit to Japan. Anyhow, during the Art Festival years, I was walking all my materials down to the Park Avenue, and, uh, setting up in front of my… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Golden Cricket Gallery, and, uh, after two years, I realized that I’m on the street… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Trying to sell paintings, and [laughs] my studio is—or my gallery—was right behind me… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And they make a commission on—on the sale of paintings, so that’s why I only did the Art Festival for… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh I don’t know—four or five years Parke A few years? McIntosh Uh, ‘cause I had gallery connections… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh On the Avenue, and you don’t do that. You… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Your gallery,back then, was taking 33 and a third percent. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Nowadays, [clears throat] it’s 50 percent, and in New York, some galleries taking[sic] 75 percent. Parke Wow, wow. McIntosh So the art—people don’t realize that artists that[sic] work in galleries are—are paying… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Quite a commission to galleries, especially if you get the kind of exposure that New York… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Major galleries give you, uh, but, uh, I—I—I opted out of the Art Festival, because, you know, it just was—I was competing… Parke Yeah. McIntosh With myself [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, it was fun back in those years. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You know, because it was pretty much local, and, uh, it grew and grew and grew and grew, and now, many[?] artists go—they paint and sculpt and do their craft part of the year, and the rest of the year, they travel… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh With a show—street shows—and they have their tents and all that stuff, and that’s half of their exposures… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Possibly happen because they don’t have to pay the galleries… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You know? Uh, that’s not the only reason it’s good exposure, but, um, it’s a wonderful learning experience to… Parke Yeah. McIntosh To have your work shown anywhere. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, you—you get comments, you get criticisms, and, uh, you get to see your own work. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh My paintings generally don’t hang around. I think I told you this before. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, when I finish a painting—and through the years having gallery associations—when I think the painting’s finished, I frame it and get it to the gallery… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And I forget them, because I’m thinking of the one I’m working on. Parke The next one [laughs]. McIntosh Yeah. Parke The upcoming one [laughs]. McIntosh The next one. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And, uh, I’ve only hung one painting, uh, of my own… Parke Yeah, that’s what you had told me before. McIntosh In my apartment and, uh, my house in Winter Park. Uh, it’s a very large, abstract painting, and you won’t believe this, but I don’t—I’ve never hung my own paintings. Parke What’s the reason behind that? Do you have a reason? McIntosh Uh, I—I wanted them to—to go to the gallery and sell. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And I—I’m interested in a new one. I don’t wanna… McIntosh Yeah. Parke If I kept that painting sitting around—you… McIntosh I’d see something… Parke You keep moving forward. McIntosh And change either[?] this or what[?], but, uh, I just got rid of it, so I could get on with the next… Parke Yeah. McIntosh One, and, uh, I produced a lot of work… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Over the years, but that particular painting, uh, sold to my friend’s<a title="">[2]</a> mother, and hangs in the Mayflower. Parke Wow. McIntosh She’s got it in her apartment. It’ll be in the show. Parke Oh, okay. McIntosh And just ran across a letter from Maury Hurt, who I told you is… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Part of the best artists in… Parke Yeah [laughs]. McIntosh In Winter Park and Orlando. Uh, there was a very nice, sensitive letter from him from a show that I had, uh—and that painting, he mentions specifically. [inaudible] I think I’ll have that framed… Parke Yeah. McIntosh And put it next to the painting in the show, because people know who Maury Hurt is here, and his word, uh… Parke Is important. McIntosh It was a compliment. It was an extreme compliment Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But the way he worded it, it’s like an artist… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Words something. Not like a—just a casual visitor. It’s a sensitive… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Approach that he put in this letter to me. So you’ll see that letter. Here you can read it if you want, but, uh, I would be happy to keep painting… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh For the rest of my days, for the next 20 years. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, I remember seeing pictures of, uh, artists, [inaudible] not [inaudible], but, uh—I’m losing it now for a minute—but I was bedridden—he was bedridden anyhow. I can’t think of his name, and they made eight-foot brushes for him. Parke So he could reach? McIntosh So he could reach the canvas. That’s how artists—some artists are [laughs]. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Uh, I—I could paint hundreds more pictures. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh But [laughs], uh, [inaudible] wheel me around pretty soon. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Um, it’s been, uh, interesting talking to you, and, uh, I hope some of this stuff… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh You understand. Parke Oh… McIntosh [inaudible]. Parke This is wonderful. McIntosh [laughs] Sorta different than other teachers. Parke It’s been great talking to you. McIntosh Especially… Parke I feel like I’ve learned a lot. McIntosh Good. Well… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh So you can paint now. Parke I can. McIntosh Yep. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh Anybody can paint. Parke Um, can I ask you one last question? McIntosh Sure. Parke Um, I know that you worked at the [Albín] Polasek Museum [& Sculpture Gardens]. Did you know Albín [Polasek] and his wife, Emily [Muska Kubat Polasek]? And… McIntosh Yes. Parke How was that for you? How were they? McIntosh Uh, Albín, I didn’t know that well. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, saw him just on different occasions and talked, but Emily, I knew and sat with her. Uh, she made cookies for me… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] And cookies that are from her home country<a title="">[3]</a>—very complex little cookies—and she even gave me the equipment to make them myself. Parke Wow [laughs]. McIntosh But, uh, I—knowing Albín and being a—a sculptor myself part-time, uh—and also, my [coughs]—my brother-in-law, Ken Wacker, along with, uh, Rever Haines, the lawyer, were very influential in the early Polasek years. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And keeping the estate, and running the—the home [inaudible]. Parke The institution, yeah. McIntosh And—and working on its future… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, through Albín when he was alive, and then very, very kindly through Emily, because, uh, she was left, but they—they were extremely influential in the early years, and, uh, I was Artistic Consultant for the museum for five years. Parke Wow. McIntosh nd, uh, I actually climbed up on the huge painting of the Man Carving His Own Destiny… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh And I was cleaning that and doing that[?]. I also knew, uh, so much about what Albín would—would have liked. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, and that’s a, uh, very sensitive thing, because, uh, you’re put with responsibility when an artist is gone, and, uh, he specifically had feelings—different feelings—about his work that I could see. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, I restored things, uh, that I discovered that he had done. Parke Yeah. McIntosh Uh, and I realized how, uh, religious a man he was. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Totally dedicated to his religion,<a title="">[4]</a> and then my partner and I, uh, designed, uh, the wall in front of the museum and the gates that… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Go in, and, uh, Eric Varty, uh, did the chapel—over the ceiling of the chapel—uh, and I had, uh the paintings of the Stations of the Cross framed and redone, because they were actually rotting out in… Parke Yeah. McIntosh That damp studio, and, uh, I did a patina—a painted patina—on all of the—the Stations of the Cross were do—done in plaster. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And they were white, and I first saw them stacked somewhere, and I convinced my brother-in-law… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh That they should be put on a wall, and they built this wall and installed these plasters on the wall—life-size from the original. I painted them and painted a patina, which is done to age the… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh o, uh, fake the age of a—of a bronze piece. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And I did that, uh, on all the statues. Parke That’s amazing. McIntosh Uh, those stations, and, uh, they were later, uh, reproduced by another artist for a client, and they came down, and now they’re having some of them cast Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Some of them are still plaster, but, uh, it just, uh—that portrait of, uh, Albín [clears throat] that hangs in the museum was done, uh, by Charles Hawthorne. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh A beautiful portrait was over the mantle. I don’t know where it is now, uh, but Charles Hawthorne was a Cape Cod painter Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And my teacher, Jerry Farnsworth, and his wife, Helen Sawyer—both famous painters—studied with Hawthorne. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh So, uh, coincidence to… Parke I was going to say that… McIntosh To… Parke That’s a huge coincidence. McIntosh I didn’t know Hawthorne, but, uh, Hawthorne’s a fabulous, fabulous… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, painter of figure—of the figure. Uh, Cape Cod has—museum has wonderful work… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Of his in Provincetown, but he taught in Provincetown, uh, in the open air, had models out by the beach. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh There are old photographs of my teachers at their easel… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh With him teaching with, uh, Provincetown… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Harbor in the background, and[?]… Parke And he just so happened—just so happened to paint Albín too. McIntosh Well, I just—I don’t know how they commissioned it—how they found this fabulous painter to do Albín—but Albín must have known his work… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, because that is a great portrait. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, but it’s a small world, you know? Parke That’s crazy. McIntosh Uh, and late in years that I, you know—way back, when I [inaudible] knew Albín briefly, uh, I met another sculptor—a major sculptor—Mahonri [Macintosh] Young, the grandson of Brigham Young. I was in his studio and I forgot where it was… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh But I was invited somehow to get into his studio. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And there was this huge portrait of a seated gentleman, and it was like about 25 feet tall, you know, in his studio in—in clay. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh It was going to be cast, and, uh, as a young student and learner, [laughs] I was so impressed seeing the scale of that work, uh, and, uh, he said, “Oh,” uh, you know, “this is gonna be cast.” He said, “I’m sorry you weren’t here when I was working on the 80 foot—180 foot tall piece,” in… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In back[?]—it was—took a whole train… Parke Wow. McIntosh To take this sculpture… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh To, uh, the—where the [inaudible]—Mormons in—in, uh—where—where are all the Mormons at? Parke In Utah. McIntosh In Utah. Parke Yeah. McIntosh And it’s a gigantic, uh, statue with dozens of figures on it. Uh, I had no idea the height of it, but it’s a major… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Piece, and, uh, uh, to see stuff in the studio that’s going to go to the foundry, you know, eventually, and just—I’ve been very lucky to have those visits. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And I had private visits with one of the top American architects, uh, Philip [Cortelyou] Johnson. The famous Glass House<a title="">[5]</a> in—in [New Canaan,] Connecticut… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, was a famous American, uh, accomplishment for—he’s—he’s passed away now, but I was—had private visit with him with, uh, another architect friend of mine to see this Glass House in person… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And to meet him, and, uh, I’ve just been very lucky to have exposure to… Parke Yeah. McIntosh Some very great people, and anyone who knows architecture knows—knows, you know, Phillip Johnson, right up there with the top architects in—in the world, but, uh, his house was fabulous. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh It’s in the woods, basically, and it has no light fixtures… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh In the house at all. The, uh—all the walls are glass all the way around, and the house is lighted by lights outside in the trees that you can’t see. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And on a rheostat[?], those lights can be turned on, so you can read in the house, and you never see a lamp or anything. Parke That’s amazing. McIntosh It’s an amazing house. You’ll… Parke Yeah. McIntosh You’ll see it… Parke [laughs]. McIntosh In a book, uh, and… Varty There’s also your involvement with, uh, Maitland Art Center and [Jules] Andre Smith. McIntosh Well, I can’t talk forever. Varty That’s a good story. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh [laughs] She’s gonna run out of juice [laughs]. Parke [laughs] I was going to say, I can come back another day… McIntosh Oh. Parke And we can talk about a lot more stuff too. McIntosh Well, that’s a—quite a good story for you—my association with, uh, [J.] Andre Smith. Parke Yeah. McIntosh At the Maitland Art Center. Parke That’s kinda where you got your, like—kinda your main start here, right? In Florida? Is that where you kinda began? McIntosh Uh, well, I began… Parke [laughs] Many years before… McIntosh Many years before. Parke But [laughs]… Varty High school. McIntosh But the, uh—my association with Andre Smith is worth a—another little time… Parke Okay. McIntosh And you’ve got plenty of… Parke Got a lot of stuff. McIntosh Yeah, but, uh, I was very close to Andre Smith, and I happened to be the only living, uh, Bok Fellow. Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, I was, uh, at—invited to live there, and I had my own studio there three different years. Parke Wow. McIntosh Different times… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Before I went in the service and came out of the service, and I was very close to Andre Smith. It was called the [Maitland] Research Studio… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Then, and the—the artists that[sic] were invited there, uh, found and all financed by Mary [Louise] Curtis Bok<a title="">[6]</a>… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Of Bok Tower [Gardens]<a title="">[7]</a>… Parke Yeah. McIntosh In [Lake Wales,] Florida. They were all older artists, and I was the only—I was 18. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh You know? Parke You were a baby still. McIntosh Well, yeah, I was, ‘cause[?] compared to them, they were all well-known Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh And, uh, uh, I became very friendly with, uh, the brother of Maurice [Brazil] Prendergast who’s… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh A famous, well-known painter—American, uh—well, landscapes, figures… Parke Mmhmm. McIntosh Uh, but the brother—brother was at the, uh, Research Studio, at that time [clears throat]—Charles, uh, Prendergast—and, uh—well, that’s another story. Parke [laughs]. McIntosh I’m getting [inaudible]. My voice is wearing. Parke Yeah—no. McIntosh Uh… Parke We’ve got a lot of stuff, so thank you so much for talking with me. McIntosh Oh, it was my pleasure. Parke And I know—I’m sure we’ll talk again soon. McIntosh Yeah… Parke Thank you. McIntosh And I—I gotta show you those two horses inside [laughs]. Parke Oh, I’m very excited about it [laughs]. <div> <div> <a title="">[1]</a> Josephine “Jo” Verstille Nivision Hopper. </div> <div> <a title="">[2]</a> Eric Varty. </div> <div> <a title="">[3]</a> Kubat was born in Prague, Czechoslovakia (present-day Czech Republic). </div> <div> <a title="">[4]</a> Roman Catholicism. </div> <div> <a title="">[5]</a> Also known as the Johnson House. </div> <div> <a title="">[6]</a> Later known as Mary Louise Curtis Bok Zimbalist. </div> <div> <a title="">[7]</a> Also known as Bok Mountain Lake Sanctuary and Singing Tower. </div> </div> 5th Street abstract art Albin Polasek Albin Polasek Museum & Sculpture Gardens antique architect architecture art art school art show artist Artistic Consultant Bassford School Blue Heron Gallery Bok Fellow Bok Mountain Lake Sanctuary and Singing Tower Bok Tower Gardens Brigham Young Cape Cod, Massachusetts Catholicism Center Street Gallery chapel Charles Hawthorne Charles Prendergast church college Commercial Street commission Cove Gallery education educator Emily Muska Kubat Emily Muska Kubat Polasek Erin Parke exhibition Farnsworth, Jerry festival Fifth Street gallery Genius, Jeanette Glass House Golden Cricket Shop Great Depression Hal McIntosh Hopper, Edward Hopper, Jo Hopper, Josephine “Jo” Verstille Nivision Japan Japanese Johnson House Jules André Smith Kent Wacker Lake Wales Lily Lake Mahonri Macintosh Young Maitland Art Center Maitland Research Studio Man Carving His Own Destiny Mary Louise Curtis Mary Louise Curtis Bok Mary Louise Curtis Bok Zimbalist Maurice Brazil Prendergast Maury Hurt McCain, Hugh McKean, Jeanette Genius Miller Gallery museum Naples Nivision, Jo Nivision, Josephine “Jo” Verstille painter painting Park Avenue Philip Cortelyou Johnson portrait portraiture school Provincetown, Massachusetts religion restoration Rever Haines Rollins College Roman Catholic Sanford Sarasota Sawyer, Helen school sculpting sculptor sculpture Solarte Stations of the Cross student teacher The Way Two Horses university Via Crucis Via Dolorosa Virginia Way of Sorrows Way of the Cross Winter Park Arts Festival https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/0814329076fb17c9b9a60e64d2441092.mp3 4d3afc70af6c37f5e5e08db488b666b7 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/d89fff5fd36fe539e5c1da44e20fcbd8.pdf 9c12d807cbfc067d407afae47676996f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project Collection Alternative Title Linda McKnight Batman Collection Subject Ocala (Fla.) Orlando (Fla.) Oviedo (Fla.) Port Tampa (Fla.) Sanford (Fla.) Silver Springs (Fla.) Titusville (Fla.) Zellwood (Fla.) Description Collection of oral histories depicting the history of Seminole County, Florida. The project was funded by Linda McKnight Batman, a former teacher, historian, and Vice President of the State of Florida Commission on Ethics. Language eng Type Collection Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a> External Reference Museum of Seminole County History, and University of Central Florida. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/744676869" target="_blank">Researcher's Guide to Seminole County Oral Histories: Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project</a>. [Sanford, Fla.]: Museum of Seminole County History, 2010. Contributor <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a> Coverage Seminole County, Florida Ocala, Florida Oviedo, Florida Port Tampa, Florida Sanford, Florida Silver Springs, Florida Titusville, Florida Zellwood, Florida Contributing Project Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer Morris, Joseph Interviewee Groskey, Dick Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Oral History of Dick Groskey Alternative Title Oral History, Groskey Subject Orlando (Fla.) Altamonte Springs (Fla.) National Aeronautics and Space Administration (U.S.) NASA Air Force World War II--United States Metalworking industries--United States Description An oral history of Dick Groskey, conducted by Joseph Morris on October 28, 2011. Born in Springfield, Ohio, Groskey migrated with his family to Orlando, Florida, in the early 1950s. In the interview, he discusses migrating to Florida, growing up in Ohio, how Orlando and Central Florida has changed over time, his experience contracting with various companies and government institutions, the metalworking industry, business taxes, his service in the U.S. Air Force during World War II, and his wife and children. Table Of Contents 0:00:00 Introduction 0:00:22 Migrating to Florida 0:02:37 Starting own business0:04:13 Growing up in Ohio 0:06:43 Decision to migrate to Florida 0:10:31 How Orlando and Central Florida has changed over time 0:15:15 Contract work with large companies 0:17:39 Working with government organizations 0:20:25 Metalworking industry 0:22:38 Business taxes 0:24:14 Current state of business 0:27:50 Positive changes in Central Florida 0:30:15 Serving in the Air Force during World War II 0:44:00 Returning to civilian life 0:45:00 Wife and children 0:50:18 Closing remarks Abstract Oral history interview of Dick Groskey Interview conducted by Joseph Morris at the <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a> in Orlando, Florida. Type Sound Source Groskey, Dick. Interviewed by Joseph Morris. October 28, 2011. Audio record available. <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a>, Orlando, Florida. Requires Multimedia software, such as <a href="http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/" target="_blank"> QuickTime</a>. <a href="https://get.adobe.com/reader/" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a> Is Part Of <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a>, Orlando, Florida. <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/123" target="_blank">Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project Collection</a>, Seminole County Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Coverage Orlando, Florida Altamonte Springs, Florida Walnut Hills, Dayton, Ohio Myitkyina West, Kachin, Burma Creator Morris, Joseph Groskey, Dick Contributor Vickers, Savannah Date Created 2011-10-28 Date Modified 2014-10-10 Date Copyrighted 2011-10-28 Format audio/mp3 application/pdf Extent 34.7 MB 211 KB Medium 51-minute, and 23-second audio recording 25-page digital transcript Language eng Mediator History Teacher Civics/Government Teacher Economics Teacher Provenance Originally created by Joseph Morris and Dick Groskey. Rights Holder Copyright to this resource is held by the <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a> and is provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. Accrual Method Donation Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a> External Reference Antequino, Stephanie Gaub, and Tana Mosier Porter. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/783150094" target="_blank">Lost Orlando</a>. Charleston, S.C.: Arcadia Pub, 2012. "<a href="http://sanfordhistory.tripod.com/Links/wtour.pdf" target="_blank">Downtown Orlando Historic District Walking Tour</a>." City of Orlando. http://sanfordhistory.tripod.com/Links/wtour.pdf. Rajtar, Steve. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/70911136" target="_blank">A Guide to Historic Orlando</a>. Charleston, SC: History Press, 2006. Transcript Morris It is October 28, 2011, and I am talking to Dick Groskey in his place of residence. I am Joseph Morris, representing the Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project for the Historical Society of Central Florida. Sir, could you tell us a little about yourself? Groskey What? Morris Could you tell us a little about yourself and your life? Groskey Well, what would you like, what would you like… Morris Well, where were you born, sir? Where were you raised? Groskey Springfield, Ohio. Morris And when did you come down to Florida, sir? Groskey Well, right after I got married in the early [19]40s. I got out of the service in ’46, and we got married the same year, and we came to Florida in the real early ‘50s. Morris Okay, sir. And did you move originally to... Groskey No. We—we were going to Miami, and I blew out a tire. It was over on U.S. [Route] 1, and we blew a tire out on the car, and it was late at night on Sunday. We stopped in a motel over on U.S. 1. The next morning, we got up and I asked where the local garage was, and they said, “Oh, it’s clear over in Bithlo. Over Dave Shaw’s garage.” So there happened to be a fellow there that was going that way, and so he took my tire, and we throwed[sic] it in the back of his truck, and he took me over Dave Shaw’s garage, which was right in the middle of no place. Well, Dave got the tire fixed, and one thing another. And in the meantime, while he was fixing the tire, I thought, “Well, I’ll look at the local newspaper.” So I’m just thumbing through it. There’s an ad in there: “Machinist wanted.” So I asked Dave Shaw, I said, “Well, where is this place?” “Oh,” he said, “That’s over in Orlando, which is short ways from Bithlo.” So I put a dime in the telephone—it was a dime at that time—and I called this man up, and he was from Youngstown, Ohio. And I told him, I said, “Well,” I said, “I’ve been a toolmaker all my life.” And he said, “I got a job for you.” He says, “Come on over!” So I said, “Well, wait ‘til I get my tire fixed, and I’ll come over.” So he gave me the directions, and I came over to Orlando, and I went down on Sligh Boulevard—and Tool Engraving on Sligh. It was Trade Tool Engraving— was the name of the place. And he said, “I’ll let you run a screw machine second shift.” I said, “Great.” [inaudible] easy. I’d run one before. So I went back to Titusville, told the missus. I said, “Well, we’re gonna have to stay here tonight, but,” I said, “tomorrow we’re going to Orlando.” And she said, “Well, what’s the matter with going to Miami?” I said, “I got a job.” She said, “You got a job?” I said, “Yeah. I go to work tomorrow night.” And I’ve never been out of work since. Morris Wow, sir. So, why were you going to Miami? Groskey I don’t know. I just thought that was a place where it was warm and there was a lot of something going on. Morris Got distracted by Orlando? Groskey And well, we got stuck here and been here ever since. Morris Then how long did you work at the... Groskey At Trade Tool? Morris Yes, sir. Groskey Only, well, best part of a year. And that’s when the Martin [Marietta Corporation] company came here, and I helped build the Martin plant. Then I went to work industrial engineering. And I stayed out there about a year and a half, I guess, and then I started my own thing, and been keeping it going ever since. Morris Okay. And how did you start your own business, sir? Groskey One tool at a time. Morris And how long have you been in business? Groskey Oh my gosh. Never [laughs]—I’ve always had a shop. We moved the shop down when I moved down from Ohio. Morris Oh really, sir? Groskey Yeah. Morris So you were doing this up in Ohio as well? Groskey Yeah. Morris The, um… Groskey I had a shop in Brookville, Ohio, and then we left Brookville to come to Florida, and I had our furniture in the shop in a—on a semi. We was gonna move it down here, and we moved, after we had the blowout over Titusville, and I got a job there, we went over here on [U.S. Route] 17-92 and rented a three-room apartment over there. And I had all the shop equipment come down then after we got established, and I rented a place over in Altamonte Springs. It was a little—about a four-story—I mean a four-office little building that Merris Walker—he owned the whole town practically. He built this building—just a little commercial building—and I rented one of the offices in there. We put all the machinery in there. And at that time, I was working at the Martin company, so we got our little shop going. So I went, quit the Martin company, went back out there, went to purchasing, I said, “I’d like to bid on your work.” And we’ve been going ever since. Morris Okay, sir. And could you tell me a little about the place where you grew up? I know it was in Ohio, correct? Groskey Mmhm. Morris Have you been back? Groskey Only when my dad died in 1966. I haven’t been back since. Morris Okay, sir. What was it like growing up out there? Groskey It was right prior to World War II, and things were tight, but it was a lot—a lot easier. Better times than what it is now. It wasn’t near as fast-paced. People had more of value than they do now. Smaller things meant more. Our—we lived in a middle-class neighborhood where everybody worked, and everybody went to school. Everybody had a car. And we played croquet at night in the backyard. We played football down at the local park. We played baseball at the local park. We played horseshoes. There was always something to do. The local park was just a matter of trees, a drinking fountain, and a shelter house, but there the city provided ball gloves and tennis racquets and things. So you’d go in there, sign your name and get a ball, go up and go play ball. Morris Okay. Groskey And that was kind of the center of activity of the whole community. We lived in what they called Walnut Hills. It was a very clannish type situation, because at that time, in that area—National Cash Register, General Motors [Company], Frigidaire, Dayton Rubber [Company], and those bigger companies—a job was something that there was nothing to be concerned about. That was something that your dad—your dad’s dad probably worked at these same companies over the last three or four generations, because that’s the way things were. You didn’t have to hunt for a job. Shop like I got now—a job shop—there was[sic] hundreds of them in that town. You’d pick up the phone call and say, “Hey, what do you got going? You got 30 days’ worth of work? I’ll be over this afternoon.” And you had another job. That’s job shopping. But if you wanted to go to the major companies like Dayton Rubber, Frigidaire, or one of the big ones—Master Electric, where they made motors—you’d go in there, hire on. They’re expecting you and your kids’ kids to work there. It was job security, which of you have none today. Today, it’s feast or famine. We get a job today, you finish it up two o’clock, goodbye. Go home. There is no security in jobs today, unless you create your own security. Morris Right, sir. Groskey There is nothing that—you can’t depend on the other man for anything. Morris Okay, sir. And how—so you left. You just wanted a change of scenery? You came down to Miami for that reason? Or you were on your way to Miami for that reason? Groskey No. I spent—like I said, I spent a lot of time over in China and Burma and India. And it was all hot weather. Very hot. We came home in February, and it was just kind of the tail end of the winter, but there was a lot of snow and ice on the ground, and after being in the tropics for that long, and coming in to snow and ice on the ground—and I got married, I told her when we got married, I said, “Look, we’re going someplace else.” I said, “I’m not gonna shovel snow.” I said, “I’m not used to this.” My later teens and then early twenties, I was overseas, and I said, “Boy, I’m not going home and shoveling any snow.” So we told her parents, we told my parents, and my dad says, “If you take her and them[sic] kids out of Ohio, I’ll disown you.” Which he did. We never got one dime from him, and he was a wealthy man. When he died, I got just exactly nothing, because I took her and came to Florida with the kids. Morris And that was your dad or her dad? Groskey No. That was my dad. Morris Wow. Groskey No. Her dad was more lenient. He was from Georgia, and was a farmer from Georgia. He had a pretty nice business going, and he said, “Well,” he said, “I can understand why you’re doing what you’re doing.” And he says, “If we can help you, we will.” But my dad was from the old school, and if it ain’t his way, it’s no way. It was that, but, he said, “You don’t know what you’re doing. You’re leaving the whole security and this and that and everything else.” I said, “No. I’m not.” I said, “Now I was in the service. I’ve been clear around the world.” I said, “I’ve seen other places. I’ve been other places and done other things. I’m not gonna sit here and shovel snow. I’m going someplace else.” “Well, if you do, you’re disowned.” And he did. Morris What did your dad do for a living? Did he work in one of these... Groskey He was vice president of the [International] Typographical Union. Morris Okay, sir. I can definitely see why, after going to the tropics, that Miami might have come to mind. Groskey That was the only—Orlando—it was just a wide spot in the road, like Kissimmee, that was just a few cars walking up and down the road. But Orlando did have a name, but it didn’t have a name like Jacksonville or Miami. Now, my wife’s from Georgia, and some of her relations—her dad, or her uncle—was warden of the Duvall County farm up there. So we came down—prior to moving, we came down here and visited, and we talked to her uncle at great length, and he was a very, very, very knowledgeable man, and he knew basics of life right here in Florida. So I asked him a lot of pointed questions. He gave me the answers. He says, “It’s gonna be up to you.” He said, “There’s[sic] opportunities here. It’s up to you to make them.” He said, “You can go out there and hustle around.” He said, “You’ll make them.” He said, “Florida’s growing.” He was born and raised there. I figured, “Well, you know what you’re talking about.” So that changed our opinion on going to Miami. After talking to people who had been there and back, and one thing another, salesmen and people who had went down there to live, and got out of the Little Havana area—whatever—they said, “Stay up in Orlando area.” Been here ever since. Morris Okay, so after you moved here, you were still thinking about going down to Miami afterwards? Groskey No. Morris Just talking to these people. Groskey No. That was it. That cancelled that out. I only went to Miami one time since we moved to Florida. We had a subcontract on the FAA [Federal Aviation Administration] building in Miami, and we supplied a lot of the high-pressure ductwork down there. We built it. And we had to get down—as owner of the shop, we had to get down to physically see that our work was in that job. It was a government job. Our work was in that building and that contract—blah blah blah blah blah. And I had to go down there about three different times. Other than that, I never went back. Morris Okay, sir. Groskey That’s where Miami and me[sic] ended. Morris That’s where you and Miami have just parted ways? Groskey Yep. Morris Okay, sir. Well, how has Orlando changed from when you moved here to now? Groskey They have ruined Orlando. Morris Really, sir? Groskey Yeah. Morris In what way? Groskey Due to the fact that the people that were responsible—once Orlando was established as a town, and the multitude started moving into that town—the way Orlando was originally set up was a farm town that was easygoing and whatever. As soon as it started to grow with a vast amount of people, which happened in the ‘50s, it really blossomed, and when it did, they lost reality with what Orlando was all about. When we moved here, you could drink the water out of Prairie Lake. You could go along, there was water along the ditches on every main road out at the main area of the town here. There was[sic] fish in these ditches. People would be along the side of Route 50<a title="">[1]</a> fishing, and water wasn’t that deep, but there was fish in them. I worked at the Martin company, and when I’d come home at night, I’d take the boys, and we’d go over to Lake Monroe and sit there on the seawall, and in an hour’s time, I’d have a bucket so full of fish you could hardly pick it up. Where’d they all go? Where’d the mullet go? Where’d the blue crabs go? Everything has been polluted. They ruined Central Florida. Now we’ve got crime. A lot more. A shooting in Central Florida back in the ‘50s—unheard of, unless it was a hunting accident. Somebody pulled out a gun and shot his own foot. It was unheard of. Now it’s an everyday occurrence. You go to Pine Hills today and somebody’s gonna shoot somebody before you can drive through it. They have ruined Central Florida, because that is the element that follows growth. There’s that type of person that will follow growth, and try to reap what they can off it, and they have ruined Central Florida. Central Florida—I won’t even go to the coast. You used to be able to go anyplace up and down the east coast. You could pull off the side of the road, cross the dunes, and go fishing. It’s all barricaded off. Chain-link fence. “Keep out.” Don’t come here, don’t go there. When we first moved, when we first got ourselves established in Altamonte Springs, I went to a council meeting, and several of the management meetings Downtown—city of Orlando. And most of the people down there—a lot of the people down there were from Baltimore[, Maryland]. Baltimore entered big in Central Florida, because the Martin came here. Martin company came here. They brought all their people with them. And come to find out, most of the people that came with the Martin company from Baltimore were the odd falls they wanted to get rid of anyway. And that’s how the Martin company started here. Well, I went—I helped build the building, then I went to work in it, and I know firsthand. But, at any rate, I had a shop in Altamonte Springs. I had the first screw machine in Seminole County. So I went to one of these meetings down there, and I got a chance to speak my voice. I got up and I said, “Well, you fellows don’t have any manufacturing base here.” I said, “You got high-acreage use plant.” I said, “You got two or three big packinghouses. One Blue Goose [Growers packinghouse].” And I said, “You’ve got another packinghouse over in Maitland, but,” I said, “you don’t have anything that’s making anything. You don’t produce any. You don’t have any sawmills. You don’t have any manufacturing, no welding shops, no nothing. Why?” “Because we’re tourist-oriented.” That’s the famous saying: “We’re tourist-oriented.” And still to this day, they’re still leaning away from manufacturing. They don’t want any manufacturing in Central Florida. I tried to explain to them how the economy in Cincinnati and Dayton was based on all these little job shops that was doing something. Now what have you got? Blacks running up and down the ladder picking oranges. That ain’t gonna help the economy. Not one nickel’s worth. The grove owner’s gonna make money, but you and I aren’t. I said, “You have to have diversified activity in that community.” And you know, they said, “Well, you’ve probably got a pretty good idea, but we don’t wanna hear no more.” And that’s where they shut it off, and I said, “Well, to hell with you. Goodbye.” And it’s still today the same situation. They want tourists. Get them in, fleece them, send them on a plane back home. They don’t want nothing here permanently. Go downtown. What have they done for the people who live here? If you go someplace, you’re gonna pay money dear for it, because you’re gonna pay just like a tourist. They don’t give the local people anything. They don’t say, “Hey, show me your driver’s license. You come in for two bucks.” “Hey, it’s $28.00? We might charge you $30.00, because you live here.” Uh-uh. I’m soured on [inaudible]. Believe me. That’s why we’re out here on our own little domain. I have nothing to do with them. Morris Okay, sir. So, um, this kind of might be a little bit of a weird question, then—so you’re not a—you don’t go to—or have you ever gone to any of the theme parks that attract the tourists? Groskey I have never. I have done work for [Walt] Disney World and Universal [Studios Orlando] and everybody else, but it’s always on a bid-item basis. The only reason I will go there is to take a job out, give them a purchase order, and hope I get paid. That’s the only way. As far as spending my money to go to their park, I wouldn’t spend a dime. Morris Yeah. They are expensive, sir. Groskey I wouldn’t spend a dime. Morris When you say “hope” you get paid, have you ever had a problem with receiving payment from these companies? Groskey Martin company and Disney started out the same way. Thirty days on invoice, 60 days on invoice, 90 days on invoice. Martin company got 120 days on invoice. I took the last invoices right down to personnel, right into payroll. I said, “I want to get paid for these.” “Well, we’re a big company, you know. It takes time.” And I said, “Now, you’re not that big.” I said, “I’m a little guy. We started out 30-day invoice, okay. 60, I can live with. 90, I’m hurting. 120, I can’t do it. Anymore work we do from you, COD [Cash on Delivery].” Now I’m a little guy talking to a big guy, and I said, “That’s it.” They needed us at that time more than we needed them, because there was nobody else except Martin [inaudible] out here that had a shot. Morris Okay, so they kept trying to put you off? Groskey That’s right. They kept stringing us out, stringing us out, and stringing us. “Well, we’re a big company!” I said, “Yes, you ought to be able to do it twice as fast. Because you have more facilities than we do. You ought to be able to make your pay the same day.” Morris Right, sir. Groskey So, I said, “C.O.D.” Morris So your business work with these companies has not been the—all you wish they could be? Groskey Well, the Martin company, as you know, right now is one of the largest defense contractors there is in the United States. And had we—at that time, had we had somebody on our side that could go internally there, today we’d probably be a multi-million dollar corporation. Because they made some big companies out of what happened at Martin company throughout the United States. Morris Okay, but because you couldn’t get anybody, or you didn’t have anybody to work with you there... Groskey We—as an outsider, we had nobody on the inside. Morris Gotcha, sir. Groskey Now, when the shuttle’s arm<a title="">[2]</a> came up at the Cape [Canaveral], when the shuttle’s arm came up, the robotic arm, we were doing NASA [National Aeronautics and Space Administration] work at the time. So I went out to procurement, and I said to them, I said, “Well, we’d like to bid on this robotic arm.” And he said, “Okay, fine.” He said, “You’re qualified. You’re DoD [U.S. Department of Defense] and checked out and everything. Fine.” We got a set of drawings, we come back, and we figured it out. We could make the complete thing except the one base had a milled slot about 12-14 feet long. We couldn’t mill it. I had a friend in Winter Haven that had a big Niles Planer [Machine]. He could do it. We submitted our bid. We were second—number two. Now, we’re a little shop, and that was a big job. There was only, I think, four of them to start with, and they were over a period of two or three years. The man out in IOA [inaudible] got the job. We went out and protested. He don’t have enough money in his bid to buy the material to do the job. The purchase agent out there on that contract was a woman. She said, “Well, Mr. Groskey,” she said, “I’ll tell you. We can’t control where he gets his material from. He may have a warehouse full.” That’s the only out I got. He may have a warehouse full. We had to buy it. He had a warehouse. I said, “Okay.” Less than 30 days, they came back and said, “We want you to pick up the contract. He went bankrupt.” I says, “Goodbye.” That’s what I told NASA. I wouldn’t touch it. Morris Oh really, sir? But you worked with NASA afterwards, right? Groskey Yeah. Morris Just not on that contract. Groskey Not on that one. Nope. We dropped that one right by the wayside. They wanted us to come back and pick up the ball, and clean up the mess, and sweep the dirt. I said, “No dice.” We don’t get it going in, we don’t want any part of it. Morris Okay, sir. Could you tell me more about the work you’ve done with NASA? Because that does a lot for the local community and the local area. Groskey No. The only thing that we got out there was small stuff that they couldn’t buy it for here [inaudible]. Onesie-twosie things that, like certain types of bearings and special screws, and just little nit-picking stuff. Nothing big. Morris Oh, okay, sir. Groskey Nothing big. No big contracts. Nothing. Biggest contract we had was from the Navy over here—the [Orlando Naval] Training Center. And we did Navy work, but there was too much red tape in all that work. I’d rather have work off the street. The last Navy job we had, they made four change orders on it. They went through a nuclear submarine. And there was[sic] four change orders. And after the second or third change order, the fourth change order went right back to the first change order, and that—we’d already scrapped it. We had to do it all over again. They don’t know what they’re doing. Morris Gotcha, sir. So, um… Groskey We’re very, very, very selective if we take work out that we don’t know the people that we’re gonna do it for. I would rather do a hundred percent commercial work. 100 percent. But right now, the customers we’ve got—we’ve got all the good customers in Central Florida—that they bring work to us. If we take something out to one of those customers, and it’s not according to what maybe they think they want, or they really need, they’ve already given us okay to do it, or purchase orders behind it. We make it, we fab it, we take it out, and if it’s not exactly what they want, it goes right in the dumpster and we get paid for it. Because that’s the way we do business. This is what you wanted, and this is what you got. Now, if you can’t use it, that ain’t my problem. You got what you ordered. And that’s the way we do business. Morris Gotcha, sir. Okay. Could you tell me a little more about the business here then? I know we discussed earlier, but could you tell me more about what kind of work you do, and who you do it for? Groskey Well, we do sheet metal work, welding, and machine work, general machine work for the complete population. No matter what industry or what kind of a business they have going, we make. We’ve made everything you could possibly think of. We’ve made parts for outboard motors, typewriters, telephones, fishing equipment, hunting equipment, dies, jigs, drill jigs, fixtures, screw machine parts. You name it. If it was made out of metal, we made it. We make high-pressure ductwork, sheet metal ductwork. We make low-pressure ductwork. We make all kind of turning veins, fittings, the whole gamut. Whatever there is in small metalwork, we do. Morris Okay, sir. And, could you tell me how… Groskey We’ve only been stymied once or twice, and that was when we had something that was a—it was more of a compound angle, and we didn’t have facilities to do it with, but I have a friend out in Apopka that’s got a water jet machine. We took it out there to him, and he water-jetted it, and we went merrily on our way. So we have an out. We take them all. Morris Gotcha, sir. Okay. Can you tell me how your business has changed over the years or grown? Groskey The business—we try to—according to the tax structure—the way it’s set up—we’re allowed a tax deduction to amortize a piece of machinery over a five-year period. And I understand [Barack] Obama has allowed small businesses to amortize that machine in one year. And I like when we bought our big boring mill down there, that’s a $12,000 machine, we could take a tax write-off in five years for that machine for the $12,000. Well, if you happen to have a good year, that $12,000 would mean a lot if you could deduct it, but you can’t deduct it except for in a five-year period. So you wind up paying more taxes for spending more money, and that’s not right. If you’re spending more money, you should be able to deduct it. Morris Okay. Groskey If it’s shop equipment, it’s capital equipment. But now—I think they got it set up now to where you can deduct that in one-year or two-year period, rather than a five-year period. Morris And you said “amortize,” right? Groskey Yeah. Morris What does that mean, sir? Groskey The government would only allow you to deduct off of your taxes—say I bought something for $1,000—a piece of machinery for $1,000. Every year I could get a $200 reduction on that piece of machinery. Morris Okay. Groskey A tax write-off on that machinery. And at the end of five years, I had a tax write-off of that $1,000. Then that machine could no longer be amortized anymore. That machine was a dead piece of equipment in that business. It was part of the business, it made the business worth that much more, but as far as taxes go, you’re done. There’s no more relief on taxes for it. Morris Okay. So, well, I know we talked about this a little bit earlier, um, how is business doing these days? Groskey Very bad. Our little shop down there was doing great up until 2002, and I could see then it was starting to slide, because we’d have customers the whole gamut of Central Florida. We’d have everything from photographic shops to big truck manufacturers, truck garages, and the likes of that. The whole gamut. We made parts for everybody. And all of them now have started slowing down, slowing down, slowing down. Because I’m interested enough to ask, “Well, Bill, how’s it going? Is your business going?” “Yeah, we’re up about 10 percent.” “We’re up 15 percent.” And it’s this way across the board. There’s only one person that’s got a business in Central Florida that’s got more business than he can handle, and that’s the auctioneers. Now, Don [M.] Dennett in Sanford—[D. M.] Dennett Auctioneering—has been a friend of mine since he was in high school, and Don is running a very good business today. We went to a sale last week over here in Casselberry. [inaudible], a multi-million dollar company, a beautiful shop, bankrupt, up for sale, it went on the auction block. I said to Don at the sale, I said, “Don,” I said, “Why in the world would something like this happen?” He said, “There’s no volume.” There’s no volume of work. He happened to have an Air Force contract that kept him going for the last two or three years. When that contract ended, he was done, because he had so much invested in big equipment, nothing to do. He had to sell out. Don says, “I could have a sale—an auction a day, if I wanted to. There’s[sic] that many people going bankrupt.” But he only has one a week, because the market will only handle so much. Otherwise, you’d have people there buying shares for a dime and the likes of it. He waits until the smoke clears, then he’ll have another auction. Morris Okay, sir. Groskey But he is busy all the time, believe me. Right now he’s ready for two more auctions. I talked to him yesterday. He got two more shops that went out, and a bunch of restaurant equipment again. A couple more restaurants went broke, and he’s gonna sell them at the auction. But he has got more work than he knows what to do with. Because that’s people’s downfall that he’s advantaged—he’s taking advantage of. Morris This is not a problem you’re having though, sir? Groskey No. We’re sitting tight. We’re solid. We don’t owe a dime to anybody. We have one thing. We buy steel on a30-day basis. We buy sheet, plate, angle, and beam, and bar from three different companies. We pay our bills at the end of the month, every month, religiously. Every 30 days, we pay our invoices up and they’re done. We run no credit with nobody, pay cash for everything. Morris Okay, sir. The proper way to run a business, right? Groskey And 90 percent of the people—I’d say 95 percent of the people that we work for appreciate that fact, because their paperwork don’t carry over month to month to month to month. When they deal with us, and come out, if we don’t have a prior agreement of 30 days on invoice, they pay cash and bring a check with them, because that’s the only way we’ll work. We won’t chase any money. You can’t spend your time chasing bad debts. And over the last 40 years, I don’t think we’ve lost a hundred dollars, and that’s because somebody died, and there was no heirs. That’s the only reason. Morris Gotcha, sir. Well, I know you said that they ruined Central Florida. Groskey Yep. That’s right. Yep. Morris Would you say there’s anything good in Central Florida, anything that—I mean, you discussed what had gone wrong. Would anything in your mind have gone right? Groskey Well, sure. What Florida did, by them having all of their eggs in one basket with tourism, they’ve helped other industries and other things grow with them. The motel industry grew, the restaurants and the stores, the retailers and one thing another. A lot of those people now have picked up to where they rely on all of these people that’s coming in. But when people come out of the airport, and they go to Disney World, they’re more or less captive at Disney World. Now, most of them are here say two days, three days a week, something like this. their money is limited to what they can do, and when they have to spend $75 to go up to that gate, they’re gonna think twice about having to go outside to buy something. Disney’s smart enough to know this. That’s why they’ve got them captive. Restaurants, hotels, motels, the whole nine yards. Get them in the gate and keep them. But there’s[sic] still a few people who want to see Central Florida. They want to get out and look around. “We haven’t come out here.” But that—Central Florida in that respect has grown along with all the tourists, and it’s helped the people that did stay here by giving them more of an opportunity to do things. Bowling alleys, and your arts, and a lot of your museums have grown. Your arts and science have grown. Everything has helped the local people, and I consider myself to be part of the local people. But they have given us an opportunity of more things which weren’t here. Morris Okay, sir. Groskey So you can give them the benefit of the doubt. They—their finances and their establishment created an environment that people wanted. So it kind of rubs off on us local people. We’re able to go take advantage of it too. Morris Okay, sir. That’s a—I was going to say, that’s a very interesting perspective, because you never go to those parks. You never do any of those things. Groskey No, no. Morris But the benefit—the side benefits they bring with them… Groskey Right. Right. Morris Gotcha, sir. I know before you mentioned you were, that you had served in the military. Groskey The military? Morris Could you tell us about that, sir? Like what branch? Where? When? What were you doing? Groskey Well, I was in the military prior to—oh, what the hell they called it? Well, when the Japanese hit Pearl Harbor. Morris Okay. Groskey And I was in Fort Knox[, Kentucky] in the regular Army before the Japanese hit Honolulu and Oahu[, Hawaii]. Now, when I went into Fort Thomas, Kentucky—I went from there to Fort Knox. I went to Fort Thomas, Kentucky, there wasn’t enough of us in that barracks to keep the fire going at night. We had to take shifts to keep the fire going at night. They declared war. The next day, they were standing in the hallways. They had to have so many people pouring into that place. There was a mobilization overnight. Believe me. Well, when I enlisted in the service—I enlisted, I was never drafted—I enlisted in the Air Force. There was[sic] no openings. So I left Fort Thomas, Kentucky, and went to Atlantic City, New Jersey, for basic training. Well, when we got out there, of course the wartime conditions and everything—blackout at night and the whole story, everything was all window-curtains [inaudible] and the likes of it, no headlights and everything. Well, I left there and went out to Chanute Fields,<a title="">[3]</a> Illinois, and joined the Air Force. They had an opening, so I got transferred from the Third [United States] Army into the Air Force, which I had enlisted for to begin with. I wanted to get in the Air Force. So I went out there to Chanute Fields and went through tech school, graduated from tech school, and got assigned to a regular Air Force unit, and was with them for quite a while. And then, well, we stationed in California, and stationed in Texas, and stationed in New Mexico and quite a few places. And then, as the [World] War [II] progressed, they took our unit and broke it up into four units, and made air combat cargo units out of them. So what we done was to air-drop supplies, ammunition, and equipment to the troops that were on the ground. That was our main—we were a transfer. I’d say an airborne trucking outfit. But on our mission, whenever we took what we had there, if there was another outstanding hospital in the area, we went to that base and haul a load of wounded back. “Litter patients,” we used to call them. So, we’d take a load of supplies over wherever we were going, and bring a load of litter patients back to the next general hospital. And that was our total obligation. And I did that in China, Burma, and India. Now, when the war ended, we were flying into Chongqing[, China] when the war ended, from Myitkyina [West], North Burma. That was our last big U.S. air base in that part of the world. And when I say “big air base”—it was a grass, dirt strip with landing mats, but that was still—in that part of the world, that was a big air base. We flew [Douglas] C-47 [Skytrain]s, [Curtiss] C-46 [Commando]s, and [Douglas] C-54 [Skymaster]s. And when the—when the Japs—we had moved out of Myikyina and went down to Bhamo, Burma right at the war’s end. And we were flying in into Saigon[, Vietnam],<a title="">[4]</a> and when the war ended, then our orders—the way our orders were written that, at the war’s end, we will be dis—our organization, equipment, will be disbanded by the most expeditious means. And our colonel, who was Colonel Scannel[sp] [inaudible], was a 36-year-old [United States Military Academy at] West Point man and a full-command pilot. Now that’s a hard nut to crack. That’s as good as you can get in the Air Force. We were all sitting down at what they called the “bomb crater.” We had a movie that night. Just a big bombed-out hole in the ground. We was all sitting around. They suddenly flashed the lights on the camera, and he says, “Boys, it’s all over.” And it took about a minute for it to sink in—the fact that the war was over. And it was. And then two days later, we pulled out of there, loaded our planes, we went back down into Tasgaon, India. But when we left, all the tents, all the equipment, the toolboxes, everything that was left on that strip, was either given to the hill tribes or was destroyed in the fire. We closed the base up, and that’s the way we left. Now, one story that vividly sticks in my mind was at Myitkyina—that’s M-Y-I-T-K-I-N-A<a title="">[5]</a>—Myitkyina, North Burma. Before the war, it was a big town. Well, the Japanese, in order to go on their route from Japan—through China into India—that’s what their object was. They’d already just about taken over China, and they were into India pretty deep. Well, our object was to see that they didn’t get any further. We were kind of stopped dead [inaudible] in the middle. MARS Task Force and Merrill’s Marauders [inaudible] were the ground troops, and we’d get everything they had—ate, fed, shot, and whatever—we supplied them—air-dropped whatever to get to them. Well, one day, on the south end of our strip, was[sic] two fighter groups that supported us as air cover while we were flying and dropping supplies—the 82nd and 93rd fighter group. There was [North American Aviation] P-51 [Mustang]s and [Republic] P-47 [Thunderbolt]s. Now, most of these fighter planes, they were bombing down at the—in the Mekong valley [inaudible], and they were down around the bridge over the River Kwai.<a title="">[6]</a> That was one of their last bombing missions. Well, the line chief and I were standing alongside the strip, and we was[sic] watching it. They’d take off about five, six, seven planes at a time. They’d fly together as a group, low-altitude bombing on these targets, like roads and bridges and commercial buildings that was of value to Japanese. So, Master Sergeant Hinky [inaudible] and I were standing there with a hot—typical hot day—and we was watching these P-47s take off, one right after the other. Well, when a fighter plane’s carrying a thousand-pound bomb under the belly of it, they got a load. Well, they would start up there at the end of the strip, and they’d tow [inaudible] them. They were full-throttle. By the time they got halfway up the strip, they’d be just about off the ground. And at the end of the strip was rice paddies and jungle. Well, we watched these planes—one, two, three. And the third one coming down the line on all of a sudden, he went straight up in the air. And line chief said to me, said, “Well, look at that damn fool.” And I said, “Yeah, but look at there.” And a thousand-pound bomb had let go of the bottom of that plane, and here he was coming down the middle of the strip tail first—a thousand-pounder. So Hinky looked at me, and I looked at him, and I said, “We better duck.” And we went under the first thing that was there, and it was a big truck, and we went under it. Well, that bomb went right at the end of the strip, went right out in the rice paddy, and just settled down as nice-you-please and didn’t explode. It went “poof” right in the mud. We crawled out from the trunk and Hinky said to me, he said, “Damn, that was close.” I says[sic], “Too close.” And I said, “Yeah, but look where we were.” And we were underneath a tanker full of hundred-octane gasoline. Oh, boy. That was a nice experience to have. That was just one of the little things that happened throughout the war. Morris When did you, what age were you signed up, sir? Groskey My 21st birthday. I was in combat. Morris Okay. When did you, uh—but you said you signed—you enlisted prior to World War II, correct? Groskey Yeah. I was 18. Morris Oh, okay. And did you enlist right after high school? Groskey Yeah. Morris Okay, sir. And, um… Groskey Matter of fact, about—I went to trade school. Morris Oh. Groskey That’s how I got my start to shops [inaudible]. I was going to trade school, and we had just finished. The way our school worked—it was called Dayton Cooperative High School. They had—well, all the instructors were professional people. They were professional in their trade. Well, the shops is what I was in basically, and of course, all of the instructors were master toolmakers. Well, when the war started, my class was just about ready. We went to school two weeks and worked two weeks. That’s the way co-op[erative] was set up. You had to carry a[sic] 80 average to go to school. If you didn’t maintain your class grades, as well as your shop grades, you got pulled out. You had to go to a regular school. You could no longer become a craftsman. You had to be interested and have a know-how to what you wanted to do. You had to want to know what you were doing. Well, at that time—that was in—oh, I think we graduated in December that year—and I went into the service September, just prior to that. And I’d say 90 percent of our class—males in our class—all went in about the same time. The whole class of ’41 just about all went in the military just about the same time. And I don’t think—of course, we lost track of all of them—but I don’t think after graduation—that year after graduation—it wasn’t more than a handful that even graduated after that because they all went in the service. Morris Was that very normal at the time, sir? Groskey Yes. Very much so. Morris Oh, okay. Groskey The patriotism was extremely high. They had—Japanese had submarines out off the East Coast, they had submarines off the West Coast. They were at our back door. Morris Hm. Okay, sir, and you said you served for five years? Groskey Mmhm. Morris And did you—was that when the war was over, or... Groskey Yeah. Yeah. Morris And you came… Groskey I was in the 1348th air combat—air drop unit. And, when that—our orders were cut in North Africa before we left Algiers[, Algeria], when we was sent into the CBI (China-Burma-India] Theater, the general that wrote our orders for our outfit said that, “You will be there for the duration plus six months.” Now that’s just like a life sentence. How long will it last? You gotta be there, and six months more. But luckily, when it ended, we was gone out of there off of our former base in two days—three days at the most. We went what they called “down the valley” into India, then we stayed there to be “disoriented”—is what they called it—to be re-civilianized. We had to turn in our guns, and all of our grenades, and all of our fighting equipment, and try to be civilians. Well, that didn’t—took longer than that to do. But anyway, we stayed there, I’d say, for a period we was in Tasgaon, India—for about a month. And then we got on the [USS] General [M. B.] Stewart and came home. We came home first-class on a big general ship, which was a well-relief. We could have hot meals. You had a bed to sleep on. I mean, you wasn’t[sic] sleeping on the ground. I mean, we’re civilians now. Yeah. This is really living. Well, anyway, we got back into Camp Atterbury, Indiana, which was a discharge center. And the man in charge of the center—our whole outfit was there. We had 1,300 men and officers with our whole complete unit. All of our pilots were drafted civil pilots—Delta, Eastern, all of them were commercial pilots. They hated the military. Between them and us, the ground people, we got along fine, because we didn’t like it either. We got along great. Well anyway, when we got into Camp Atterbury, we got all the shots and all the rest of the stuff, and turned everything in, and got all the paperwork done, the commanding officer of that base had our commander, General Scannel—or Colonel Scannel—stand up, and he said, “Colonel,” he said, “we want to offer you people, your outfit, 1,380 men, all an increase in rank, one rank, with a one-year contract.” The Colonel says, “I would like to speak for our men, in behalf of them.” He said, “We have 1,500 hours, most of us, of combat flying.” He said, “We want to go home and stay there. It’s your baby. We quit.” And that’s the way it ended. There wasn’t one man re-enlisted. We had it. Morris You had your fill? Groskey We had it. Don’t want no part of it. But I’ll tell you still today—still today, there’s[sic] things at night flash through my mind of what we had done and what we did. Morris Well, thank you for your service. Groskey It sticks in your mind. At that time, and the way the elements, and the way everything was, you don’t forget things like that. No, I don’t care how old you get, you will not forget them. You try to, but there’s[sic] things that always come back, like things that got blew[sic] up, and things that got burnt out, and stuff. You don’t forget it. I don’t care what you do. I’d be down running lath, and sometime you remember that time or something like that. We changed an engine [inaudible], and we used to call him “Tokyo Joe.” There was a zero. He used to come over about two o’clock every afternoon, and he’d drop what they called cluster bombs. Small, little ones. Just enough to worry you. Well, one of them hits your tent—boy, you got a mess. Blow everything up. Tokyo Joe would come out every afternoon two o’clock, and he’d drop a few cluster bombs, and back over the mountains he’d go. Well finally, one day, we had a [Lockheed] P-38 [Lightning] group that was going into Saigon. And this one pilot, he said, “Well, you know,” he said, “I’m gonna get that S.B.” He said, “I can fly higher than he can.” So here come old Tokyo Joe over one afternoon right after chow, and we seen[sic] this boy fire that P-38 up and he went straight up in the air, and Tokyo Joe knew something was happening. He turned tail and started to run, and before he got over the base of the Chin Hills, he blew him out of the sky. That was the end of the Japs. That was the last time we had him. Morris No more Tokyo Joe? Groskey No more Tokyo Joe. Morris Well, what would you do with your afternoons after that, then, sir? Groskey Oh, we worked, we worked round the clock. We had them—our planes flew seven days a week, 24 hours a day. Morris Okay, sir. How long after you got back before you moved to Florida? How long did that take? Did you have to shovel snow for a winter? Groskey No. it wasn’t too long. A couple years. Yeah. Morris Oh okay, sir. Groskey Well, I was just feeling things out to try to become a civilian again, and decide which way I wanted to go. I knew I wanted to be into metalwork, but I didn’t know how I wanted to approach it. I didn’t know exactly how I wanted to do it—how I wanted to really get things started. And then, as we got married, and we had a couple kids, and one thing another started, I said, “Well, I gotta get my own business going. That’s all there is to it.” I just can’t—I can’t work for somebody else, because he’s not only going to take the cream of the crop, and I’m going to do all the dirty work. I want to be in a position where I can do the dirty work, take the cream of the crop, and try to establish some new business. Try to build a new product. Try to do things. Morris Makes sense, sir. Groskey Without being a number in somebody’s shop. So that was the way it started, that’s the way Reg Co. came about. Morris Okay, sir. Can you tell me about your family? Groskey Yeah. Morris Like who they are, how old, what year were they born? Groskey Okay. Well, we got married in 1946. And Larry [Groskey]—Larry is the oldest one. He come along a year later. And Ronnie [Groskey] was the next son born, about a year or two later. Then the twins came along about two years later. Morris Two boys? Two girls? Groskey Karen [Groskey] and Sharon [Groskey]. And then Rusty [Groskey] came along about a year after that, and then that was the end of our family. We had five children. Morris And what’s your wife’s name, sir? Groskey Mary Ann [Groskey]. Morris Oh, okay. And what are your children doing now? Groskey Well, the oldest one, Larry, is up in De Leon Springs. He’s got a rat farm. He raises rats commercially. These people that have reptiles and all kinds of weird people—they—he’s got a steady stream. He’s got quite an operation going, many buildings full of these rats. And he sells them all over the world. Now, there’s that many kooks out there, but he’s got a real good business going. Morris Okay, sir. Groskey Now, the other son, Ronnie—he’s got a drywall business. He does drywall work and painting. The girls—Sharon, my one daughter, is a schoolteacher over in Sanford. Karen is an expediter for Fed Ex downtown. And Rusty works in the shop with me. Morris Oh, okay, sir. And, do you have a—how did you meet your wife? Groskey Well, that was a long story too. At—we both worked at National Cash Register. When I came out of the service, I went to work for National Cash Register, because my dad had worked there all his life, her dad had worked there all his life. So it was just a simple matter of walking in, getting a job, because that was where you—if you decided to work there, you had a lifetime job. They didn’t hire people and fire them the next day. There was enough business in that company. It was self-sustaining. When they made National Cash Register, they went all over the world and there was boxcar loads of material coming in every day. It was its own entity. When you went to work there, you quit looking for a job, because if you couldn’t make it one department, they’d transfer you to another department. There was 38,000 people working in that building—in that factory. They could find something for you to do. They had a huge restaurant. So at noontime one day, the fellow that I was kind of running with at the time—he was a Navy man. We got along real good. He was running screw machines. So was I. So one day at noontime I said—well Friday, they always had fish fry, and boy, it was good fish. So Friday we’d go to the mess hall and eat lunch. Well, while we were sitting there eating lunch, Annie and her girlfriend—she worked up in Building 4. It was assembly—some kind of assembly job. Well anyway, her and her girlfriend was down there eating too. One of them had dropped a spoon on the floor. And I don’t know whether Mike picked it up or I did, but one of us picked it up, and we handed it to them, and we got to talking, and that’s how it started. Morris Okay, sir. Something as small as a… Groskey It was obscure as obscure can be. So I said to her, I said, “Yeah, my name’s Dick.” She said, “My name’s Ann.” And she said, “I work over in Building 4.” I said, “Well, we work in Building 27.” And we got to talking there for a few minutes, just at lunch period, and I said, “Well,” I says[sic], “where do you live?” She says, “I live out off of Smithville Road.” And I said, “Well, I live out in Walnut Hills”—both parts of east Dayton. And, I says, “Well, what are you gonna do Friday night?” She said, “I don’t know.” I said, “Well, you want to go bowling?” She said, “Sure.” I got her phone number, and that was it. We started going together. We got married, and she got laid off, because at NCR, you couldn’t have two people in the same family unless they were married, and once they got married, you couldn’t hire them. Two people can’t work there. Morris Okay. Groskey She got married. She got laid off. Well, that’s how it started. So we got married, she got laid off, and I went out, I bought a little piece of property, and I started building a house, and over a period of about two years, I got the house built, and we had all the children then. Well, most of the children then. And one thing led to another, and we outgrew that, and we went out in the country, and I bought five acres and built a house out there, and when all the children were in school, that’s when we came to Florida. Things got real bad up there, up there in the ‘50s. You couldn’t buy a job. It got the same way here, except it was localized. And I went to Indiana, went to Kentucky, I went all over. There was[sic] no jobs. Nobody was hiring. So I said, “Okay.” I said, “We’re not shoveling more snow.” I said, “We’re loading up and we’re leaving.” So I hired a local trucker. I said, “Now, I want you to move my shop.” We took just the prime equipment out of there, just enough to know we could make a living. Drills and saws, a couple laths, and one thing another. Everything else, had a public sale. Sold the house, the farm, everything. We got in the truck and we moved, come to Florida. Been here ever since. Morris Had a lot of reasons to come to Florida. Groskey Yep. And like I say, when I went to work at Trade Tool Engraving, we’ve never gone out of a job since. I went back to the motel in Titusville, I said, “I wanna pack a sandwich and a couple apples or something.” I said, “I’m going to work tonight.” She says, “You’re doing what?” I said, “I got a job over in Orlando.” She says, “You kidding me?” I says, “No. here’s the paper.” And looked at it, and she said, “Well, I’ll be damned.” Been working ever since. Morris Well, there you go, sir. Do you feel like there’s anything we haven’t talked about that you’d like to talk about? Groskey No. We’re just about as plain as you can get. Everybody in this part of the world knows us and knows what we do. We’ve got a reputation for doing a good job quick at a fair price. We—I don’t think we’ve had more than one or two disgruntled people that needed something done, and that was the fact that they were the type of people that nobody could satisfy. They have never come back, and I’m glad of it. Now, as you see, we have no advertisement whatsoever, yet we’re busy all the time. That speaks for itself. We do good work on time at a good price. And people always come back. Morris The ones you want to come back [laughs]. Groskey And they will tell somebody else. I always give them a business card. I said, “Now, your neighbor wants something done, here it is.” That’s the only advertisement we got. Morris Okay. Well, thank you, sir, for taking the time out today. Groskey I’ll show you one of my cards here. Yeah. There you got them right there. <div> <div> <a title="">[1]</a> Florida State Road 50. </div> <div> <a title="">[2]</a> Shuttle Remote Manipulator System (SRMS), also known as Canadarm 1. </div> <div> <a title="">[3]</a> Chanute Air Force Base (AFB). </div> <div> <a title="">[4]</a> Present-day Ho Chi Minh City. </div> <div> <a title="">[5]</a> Correction: Myitkyina. </div> <div> <a title="">[6]</a> Khwae Yai River. </div> </div> Altamonte Springs Atlantic City, New Jersey auctioneering Bithlo Brookville, Ohio Canadarm 1 CBI Theater China-Burma-India Theater contractors D. M. Dennett Auctioneering Dave Shaw Dayton Cooperative High School Dayton, Ohio Dick Groskey Don M. Dennett Florida State Road 50 Fort Knox, Kentucky Fort Thomas, Kentucky Historical Society of Central Florida Japan Japanese Joseph Morris Karen Groskey Larry Groskey Linda McKnight Batman Oral History Project little patients Martin Marietta Corporation Merris Walker metalworking Miami Morris, Joseph Museum of Seminole County History Myitkyina West Myitkyina, Myanmar NASA National Aeronautics and Space Administration National Cash Register orlando Orlando Naval Training Center Pearl Harbor, Hawaii Reg Company Ronnie Groskey Rusty Groskey Sharon Groskey Shuttle Remote Manipulator System Springfield, Ohio SR 50 SRMS tax taxes Tokyo Joe tourism Trade Tool Engraving U.S. 1 U.S. 17-92 U.S. Air Force U.S. Army U.S. Navy U.S. Route 1 U.S. Route 17-92 USS General M. B. Stewart veterans Walnut Hills World War II WWII Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A History of Central Florida Collection Alternative Title History of Central Florida Collection Subject Podcasts Documentaries Description A History of Central Florida Podcast series explores Central Florida's history through the artifacts found in local area museums and historical societies. Contributor <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> Cassanello, Robert Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/70" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida. Language eng Type Collection Coverage Altoona, Florida Astor, Florida Brevard County, Florida Bushnell, Florida Clermont, Florida Cocoa Beach, Florida Daytona Beach, Florida DeLand, Florida Disston City, Florida Fort King, Florida Geneva, Florida Goldenrod, Florida Groveland, Florida Holly Hill, Florida Hontoon Island, DeLand, Florida Jacksonville, Florida Kissimmee, Florida Lake Apopka, Florida Lake County, Florida Lake Mary, Florida Marion County, Florida Merritt Island, Florida Miami, Florida Mims, Florida Mount Dora, Florida Newnans Lake, Gainesville, Florida New Smyrna, Florida New Smyrna Beach, Florida Ocala, Florida Ocklawaha River, Florida Orlando, Florida Ormond Beach, Florida Osceola County, Florida Sanford, Florida Silver Springs, Florida St. Augustine, Florida St. Cloud, Florida St. Johns River, Florida St. Petersburg, Florida Tampa, Florida Tavares, Florida Weirsdale, Florida Winter Garden, Florida Winter Park, Florida Ybor City, Tampa, Florida Rights Holder <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a> Contributing Project <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a> External Reference "<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">RICHES Podcast Documentaries</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php. Moving Image A series of visual representations that, when shown in succession, impart an impression of motion. Original Format 1 video podcast Duration 14- minutes and 20 seconds Producer Cassanello, Robert Director Ford, Chip Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A History of Central Florida, Episode 33: Salt and Pepper Shakers Alternative Title Salt and Pepper Shakers Podcast Subject Clermont (Fla.) Tourism--Florida Salt and pepper shakers Ceramics--United States Souvenirs (Keepsakes)--United States Description Episode 33 of A History of Central Florida Podcast: Salt and Pepper Shakers. A History of Central Florida Podcast series explores Central Florida's history through the artifacts found in local area museums and historical societies. These podcasts can involve the participation or cooperation of local area partners. Episode 33 features a discussion of souvenir salt and pepper shakers sold to tourists during the 20th Century. This podcast also includes interviews with Andrea Ludden of the Salt and Pepper Shaker Museum, Dr. Tracy J. Revels of Wofford College, and Dr. Nick Wynne of the Florida Historical Society. Type Moving Image Source Original 14-minute and 20-second podcast by Chip Ford, 2014: "A History of Central Florida, Episode 33: Salt and Pepper Shakers." <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida</a>, Orlando, Florida. Requires <a href="http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/" target="_blank">Adobe Flash Player</a> <a href="http://java.com/en/download/index.jsp" target="_blank">Java</a> Is Part Of <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida</a>, Orlando, Florida. <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/137" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida Collection</a>, RICHES Podcast Documentaries Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. Coverage Clermont Historic Village, Clermont, Florida Orange County Regional History Center, Downtown Orlando, Florida Japan Creator Ford, Chip Publisher <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> Contributor Ludden, Andrea Revels, Tracy J. Wynne, Nick Cassanello, Robert Clarke, Bob Gibson, Ella Hazen, Kendra Kelly, Katie Velásquez, Daniel Wollsdstat, Roger <a href="http://www.s-lchs.org/" target="_blank">Clermont Historic Village</a> <a href="http://www.loc.gov/" target="_blank">Library of Congress</a> <a href="http://www.floridamemory.com/" target="_blank">Florida Memory Project</a> Date Created ca. 2014-11-17 Date Issued 2014-11-17 Date Copyrighted 2014-11-17 Format video/mp4 Medium 14-minute and 20-second podcast Language eng Mediator History Teacher Economics Teacher Humanities Teacher Virtual Arts Teacher Provenance Originally created by Chip Ford and published by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a>. Rights Holder <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES</a> Accrual Method Item Creation Contributing Project <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/podcastsblog.php" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida</a> Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> External Reference "<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/items/show/45722" target="_blank">A Hsitory of Central Florida, Episode 33: Salt and Pepper Shakers</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/items/show/4572. Revels, Tracy J. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/666240031" target="_blank">Sunshine Paradise: A History of Florida Tourism</a>. Gainesville: University Press of Florida, 2011. Wynne, Nick. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/42845027" target="_blank">Tin Can Tourists in Florida 1900-1970</a>. Charleston, SC: Arcadia Press, 1999. Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website) <a href="https://youtu.be/509343GIeAk" target="_blank">A History of Central Florida, Episode 33: Salt and Pepper Shakers</a> Extent 221 MB A History of Central Florida Airko Manufacturing Company alligator farms alligators Andrea Ludden automobiles Bob Clarke camping cars Central Boulevard ceramics Chip Ford Clermont Clermont Historical Village Daniel Velásquez Ella Gibson Florida Historical Society Gatlinburg, Tennessee gators Great Depression hotels Japan Katie Kelley Kendra Hazen Lakeside Motel Ludden, Andrea motels motor vehicles Nick Wynne OCRHC Orange County Regional History Center orlando pepper shakers Robert Cassanello Salt and Pepper Shaker Museum salt shakers Souvenir Road souvenirs tin can tourism tin can tourists tourism Tracy J. Revel Tracy J. Revels West Avenue William F. Naval World War II WWII https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/c48baf4f4b4c71c43a995d10ebdc7c5e.jpg 2af00b7fcf65118fa26b09a5975ea677 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/5fd9ed14b8c663b3d3dd0fb06a98a1c3.jpg 2486e32b9cad19351b9cd47edf87f0da https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/4caf6d38c4f07e0e5e63d4ff296dc303.jpg cf0f1eda3d488add9b113f900c285ac0 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/ffee0e3dfdf21a69934f600108b4c65d.jpg 13f464119e09c4c5a496931dafaf5fe3 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/4ce6a16dd9e2f051f967eb1f11527243.jpg df6627b6332552128735214f1b56da70 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/496ae1e1b6902cd34441f0dbc709886f.jpg 952b8580f90471458d4028c9a9151b3e https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/c116b3583adbe5adefc74c4078fb22c9.jpg deb4e2d91d0cc2508fe6dbef90b33e72 https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/6dda6832915844fd86bc5d878ef23486.jpg 8394c9c16a72b3b8d3790db3fd9165fd Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Central Florida Monuments Collection Alternative Title Monuments Collection Subject Florida Orlando (Fla.) Kissimmee (Fla.) Sanford (Fla.) Winter Springs (Fla.) Memorials--Florida Description Central Florida is a unique place. Diversity exists throughout the spectrum of population, neighborhoods, tourism, and attractions. Because of our uniqueness and seemingly never-ending list of things to do, we tend to overlook the things that make us unique. We tend to overlook our past. We walk through parks, down the street, and around lakes, catch a glimpse of a commemorative plaque or statue, but it stops there. Central Florida is rich of monuments and memorials, yet very rarely do we know why it is there and who put it there. Our small University of Central Florida Public History class selected a number of memorials and monuments around Central Florida. We found busts, markers, structures, and statues that stand tall. Some of these are obvious, but others are hidden amongst the brush. We had no idea what we would find in regards to these gems; some of us found very little, but others found gold. We found that monuments in places like Kissimmee, Lake Eola, and Sanford offer a glimpse into our past that has been overlooked, and in some cases untouched. Through the history of our monuments and memorials, we have been able to gauge social sentiment, populations, but more importantly, the reasons why our predecessors have commemorated what they have. Our sampling in no way represents all of the history Central Florida has to offer, but we can offer you a glimpse and hope that you dig further through the history our region has to offer. Come into our exhibit and look through our shared past and see what was important, and what has been forgotten. Come in and see for yourself a familiar statue to which you can finally give meaning. Come in and see Central Florida in a new light— a light that will take you through the years and the changes of our region. Contributor Bowers, Katherine Borawski, Gianna Dunn, Robin Fitzsimons, Daniel Kittel, Carly Messamore, Kyle Schell, Kristal Schuppe, Cody Language eng Type Collection Coverage Bataan-Corregidor Memorial, Lakefront Park, Kissimmee, Florida Battle of the Bulge Memorial, Lake Eola Park, Downtown Orlando, Florida Bust of Simón Bolívar, Lake Eola Park, Downtown Orlando, Florida Confederate Soldiers, Sailors, and Statesmen Memorial, Lake Eola Park, Downtown Orlando, Florida Orange County World War I Soldiers Memorial, Downtown Orlando, Florida Red Chinese Ting, Lake Eola Park, Downtown Orlando, Florida Seminole County World War I Memorial, Sanford, Florida Winter Springs Veterans Memorial, Winter Springs, Florida Contributing Project <a href="http://history.cah.ucf.edu/staff.php?id=525" target="_blank">Dr. Anne Lindsay</a>'s Public History: Principles and Techniques Undergraduate Class Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>. "<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/exhibits/show/cflmonuments" target="_blank">Hidden in Plain Sight: A Selection of Central Florida Monuments</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/exhibits/show/cflmonuments. External Reference Dickinson, Greg, Carole Blair, and Brian L. Ott. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/663080291" target="_blank">Places of Public Memory The Rhetoric of Museums and Memorials</a>. Tuscaloosa: University of Alabama Press, 2010. Bodnar, John E. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/23731520" target="_blank">Remaking America: Public Memory, Commemoration, and Patriotism in the Twentieth Century</a>. Princeton, N.J.: Princeton University Press, 1991. Still Image A static visual representation. Examples of still images are: paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type "text" to images of textual materials. Original Format 8 color digital images Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Bataan-Corregidor Memorial at Lakefront Park Description The Bataan-Corregidor Memorial, located on the corner of East Monument Avenue and Lakeshore Boulevard in Lakefront Park, is the result of the combined efforts of the Filipino-American community and the City of Kissimmee. It began in the late 1980s when resident and a former Filipino diplomat, Menandro M. de Mesa, recognized the lack of recognition received for those who fought and perished during the fall of Bataan and Corregidor and the subsequent Death March in World War II. At an annual conference, de Mesa befriended City Commissioner Richard Herring, who also shared the same sentiments towards the victims and veterans of the events. Together, the two founded the nonprofit Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Foundation. In 1991, using his influence as City Commissioner, Richard Herring was able to persuade the City of Kissimmee to donate a piece of land in Lakefront Park for a future Bataan-Corregidor memorial. Groundbreaking for the memorial took place in 1994, and in 1995, the memorial was unveiled. The memorial features several benches, a stone dedication, an American flag, a Filipino flag, and the centerpiece: a statue depicting an American G.I. and a Filipino soldier being offered water by a Filipino woman during the Death March. Since its dedication, the memorial has become the site of annual meetings of WWII veterans who survived the infamous Death March. It has also come to be the site of annual gatherings of Filipinos and Americans celebrating Filipino-American Friendship Day on April 9th. The Battle of Bataan lasted from January 7 to April 9, 1942, and marked the most vital phase of the Empire of Japan's invasion of the Philippines during World War II. The United States defended the Commonwealth of the Philippines, but ultimately the battle resulted in the largest surrender in both American and Filipino military history. The forced transfer of 60,000-80,000 Filipino and American prisoners of war (POWs), known as the Bataan Death March, began on April 9. The POWs were subjected to physical abuse and murder. An estimated 2,500 to 10,000 POWs died before reaching Camp O'Donnell. After Bataan fell, organized opposition against Imperial Japan in the Philippines became decimated. The Battle of Corregidor was waged on May 5 and 6 and resulted in another American-Filipino defeat. This event marked the fall of both the Philippines and Asia to Imperial Japan. American and Filipino forces were able to recapture the island in 1945 and the Bataan Death March was declared a war crime following the end of World War II. Date Created 2013-10-10 Coverage Bataan-Corregidor Memorial, Lakefront Park, Kissimmee, Florida Bataan, Central Luzon, Philippines Corregidor Island, Philippines Mariveles, Bataan, Central Luzon, Philippines San Fernando, Pampanga, Philippines Camp O'Donnell, Capas, Tarlac, Philippines Creator Messamore, Kyle Source Original color digital images by Kyle Messamore, October 10, 2013. Rights Holder Copyright to this resource is held by Kyle Messamore and is provided here by <a title="RICHES of Central Florida" href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. External Reference "<a href="http://bataan-corregidormemorial.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">The Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Foundation, Inc.</a>" The Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Foundation, Inc. http://bataan-corregidormemorial.blogspot.com/. Elphick, Ellen Lansigan. "<a href="http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=CFg1AAAAIBAJ&sjid=iCUMAAAAIBAJ&pg=1329%2C35680483" target="_blank">Florida County Celebrates Fil-Ann Day</a>." Phillipine Daily Inquierer, April 9, 2005. http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=CFg1AAAAIBAJ&sjid=iCUMAAAAIBAJ&pg=1329%2C35680483. Elphick, Ellen Lansigan. "<a href="http://archive.osceolanewsgazette.com/popups/newswindow.php?id=10464&print=print" target="_blank">Richard Herring a True Friend of Filipinos</a>." Osceola News Gazette, April 7, 2005. http://archive.osceolanewsgazette.com/popups/newswindow.php?id=10464&print=print. Elphick, Ellen Lansigan. "<a href="http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=4945025ee98608cd16922dadf6b71f2e" target="_blank">Floridian Builds Monument to Filipino-American Wartime Friendship</a>." Pinoy Newsmagazine, August 21, 2009. http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=4945025ee98608cd16922dadf6b71f2e. Breuer, William B. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/61878968" target="_blank">The Great Raid: Rescuing the Doomed Ghosts of Bataan and Corregidor</a>. New York: Miramax, 2005. Greenberger, Robert. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/245537219" target="_blank">The Bataan Death March: World War II Prisoners in the Pacific</a>. Minneapolis, Minn: Compass Point Books, 2009. Norman, Michael, and Elizabeth M. Norman. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/263984541" target="_blank">Tears in the Darkness: The Story of the Bataan Death March and Its Aftermath</a>. New York: Farrar, Straus, and Giroux, 2009. Thompson, Jan, and Alec Baldwin. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/774918273" target="_blank">The Tragedy of Bataan</a>. [United States]: PBS Distribution, 2012. Young, Donald J. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/646854098" target="_blank">The Battle of Bataan A Complete History</a>. Jefferson, N.C.: McFarland & Co, 2009. Transcript BATAAN-CORREGIDOR MEMORIAL "A TRIBUTE TO COURAGE" DEDICATED ON MAY 20, 1995 BATAAN - CORREGIDOR MEMORIAL "A TRIBUTE TO COURAGE" THIS MONUMENT IS DEDICATED TO THE AMERICANS AND FILIPINOS WHO SERVED IN DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACY IN THE PHILIPPINES DURING WORLD WAR II ESPECIALLY IN BATAAN AND CORREGIDOR AND ON THE INFAMOUS DEATH MARCH A PROJECT OF THE FILIPINO-AMERICAN COMMUNITY AND THE CITY OF KISSIMMEE 1994 THE SIEGE OF BATAAN & CORREGIDOR Following the attack on Pearl Harbor, Japan invaded the Philippines on December 8, 1941, forcing General Douglas MacArthur and his forces to withdraw to the Bataan Peninsula for their last stand against the advancing Japanese Imperial Army. The adjoining fortified island of Corregidor at the entrance to Manila Bay became the headquarters of all American and Filipino forces. Outgunned, they took on the Japanese on Bataan for 99 days, living on less than half-rations. With food, medicine, ammunition and any hope of being rescued gone, over 76,000 exhausted men - most of them Filipinos - surrendered to the Japanese on April 9, 1942. Corregidor, with its 11,000 defenders, fell on May 6, 1942. The prolonged defense of Bataan and Corregidor upset Japan's timetable and saved Australia. Then came the tragic Bataan Death March - the tortuous 65-mile trek to the prison camps with no food, water or rest. According to the International War Crimes Commission, 10,300 people - including women and children - died of disease, starvation, sadistic beatings and outright execution during the march. Many of those who survived the camps were shipped to Japan, Korea and Manchuria, an sold as slave labor to factories and mining companies. Of the 36,000 Americans who defended Bataan and Corregidor, only about 7,000 were left at war's end. They received their campaign ribbons when they returned to the Philippines in September 1945, before heading to the United States. TRAIL'S END. The survivors who straggled through the gates of Camp O'Donnell did not know how many of their fellow soldiers had failed to make it. THE ASSEMBLY POINT. American and Filipino soldiers streamed into Balanga by foot and by truck. As they gathered for what was to become a death march they were crowded into open fields under the hot sun. Route of the Death March THIS MONUMENT IS DEDICATED TO THE AMERICANS AND FILIPINOS WHO SERVED IN DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACY IN THE PHILIPPINES DURING WORLD WAR II ESPECIALLY IN BATAAN AND CORREGIDOR, AND ON THE INFAMOUS DEATH MARCH. A PROJECT OF THE FILIPINO-AMERICAN COMMUNITY AND THE CITY OF KISSIMMEE 1994 Alternative Title Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Subject Kissimmee (Fla.) Bataan, Battle of, Philippines, 1942 Bataan Death March, Philippines, 1942 World War II Memorials--Florida Filipino Americans Veterans--Florida Contributor Messamore, Kyle Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/admin/collections/show/77" target="_blank">Central Florida Monuments Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida. "<a title="Hidden" href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/exhibits/show/cflmonuments" target="_blank">Hidden in Plain Sight: A Selection of Central Florida Monuments</a>." RICHES of Central Florida. Format image/jpg Extent 2.45 MB 2.46 MB 1.93 MB 3.38 MB 4.41 MB 2.53 MB 2.52 MB 2.67 MB Medium 8 color digital images Language eng Type Still Image Accrual Method Item Creation Mediator History Teacher Civics/Government Teacher Geography Teacher Humanities Teacher Visual Arts Teacher Provenance Originally created and owned by Kyle Messamore. Contributing Project <a href="http://history.cah.ucf.edu/staff.php?id=525" target="_blank">Dr. Anne Lindsay</a>'s Public History: Principles and Techniques Undergraduate Class Curator Messamore, Kyle Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Army Australia Balanga Bataan Death March Bataan Peninsula Bataan-Corregidor Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Bataan-Corregidor Memorial Foundation Battle of Bataan Battle of Corregidor Camp O'Donnell campaign City of Kissimmee Commonwealth of the Philippines de Mesa, Menandro M. death march Empire of Japan Filipino Filipino American Filipino-American community Filipino-American Friendship Day General MacArthur Herring, Richard International War Crimes Commission IWCC Japan Japanese Japanese Imperial Army Kissimmee Lakefront Park Lakeshore Boulevard MacArthur, Douglas Manila Bay memorial Messamore, Kyle monument Monument Avenue Pearl Harbor, Hawaii Philippines veteran World War II WWII https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/01ee8eb22de0f9919954279ecfb2bc25.pdf 83a9b27535ae245aefccc59e7fd3865c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Thomas Cook Collection Alternative Title Cook Collection Subject Orlando (Fla.) Orange County (Fla.) Longwood (Fla.) Cape Canaveral (Fla.) Lake Wales (Fla.) Silver Springs (Fla.) Weeki Wachee (Fla.) Winter Haven (Fla.) Osceola County (Fla.) Winter Park (Fla.) Description Collection of digital images, postcards, documents, and other records from the private collection of Thomas Cook. Series descriptions are based on special topics, the majority of which students focused their metadata entries around. Contributor Cook, Thomas Language eng Type Collection Coverage Cape Canaveral, Florida Lake Wales, Florida Longwood, Florida Orange County, Florida Orlando, Florida Osceola County, Florida Winter Haven, Florida Winter Park, Florida Rights Holder All items in the <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/102" target="_blank">Thomas Cook Collection</a> are provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. Curator Cepero, Laura Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository Private Collection of Thomas Cook Has Part <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/103" target="_blank">Postcard Collection</a>, Thomas Cook Collection, RICHES of Central Florida. External Reference Antequino, Stephanie Gaub, and Tana Mosier Porter. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/783150094" target="_blank">Lost Orlando</a> Charleston, S.C.: Arcadia Pub, 2012. "<a href="http://sanfordhistory.tripod.com/Links/wtour.pdf">Downtown Orlando Historic District Walking Tour</a>." City of Orlando. http://sanfordhistory.tripod.com/Links/wtour.pdf. Rajtar, Steve. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/70911136" target="_blank">A Guide to Historic Orlando</a>. Charleston, SC: History Press, 2006. Osborne, Ray. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/253374549" target="_blank">Cape Canaveral</a>. Charleston, SC: Arcadia Pub, 2008. Smith, Margaret. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/51888803" target="_blank">The Edward Bok Legacy: A History of Bok Tower Gardens: The First Fifty Years</a>. Lake Wales, Fla: Bok Tower Gardens Foundation, 2002. Pelland, Maryan, and Dan Pelland. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/67516850" target="_blank">Weeki Wachee Springs</a>. Charleston, SC: Arcadia, 2005. Flekke, Mary M., Sarah E. MacDonald, and Randall M. MacDonald. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/85451307" target="_blank">Cypress Gardens</a>. Charleston, SC: Arcadia, 2006. Still Image A static visual representation. Examples of still images are: paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type "text" to images of textual materials. Original Format 1 color map Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title Walt Disney Road Atlas for Cast Members Alternative Title Walt Disney World Atlas Subject Walt Disney World (Fla.)--Maps Amusement parks--Florida Lake Buena Vista (Fla.)--Maps Magic Kingdom (Fla.) EPCOT Center (Fla.)--Maps Description Cast Member Map of Walt Disney World from 1986, showing such locations as the Magic Kingdom, EPCOT Center, the future location of the Disney-MGM Studios, Fort Wilderness Campground, the Contemporary Resort, Lake Buena Vista Village, Walt Disney World Village, and the future location of Pleasure Island. This map was issued to all new employees around 1986. It was not for public/tourist use, as it lists all areas that are accessible by employees only. This includes employee parking areas, access roads as well as a map of the Magic Kingdom Tunnel complex, the underground corridors and rooms that the rest of the Magic Kingdom is built upon. Source Original map, 1986: <a href="http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/" target="_blank">Walt Disney Company</a>: Private Collection of Thomas Cook. Publisher <a href="http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/" target="_blank">Walt Disney Company</a> Date Created 1986 Is Format Of Digital reproduction of original map, 1986: <a href="http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/" target="_blank">Walt Disney Company</a>. Is Part Of <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/102" target="_blank">Thomas Cook Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida. Requires <a href="http://www.adobe.com/reader.html" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a> Format application/pdf Extent 58.5 MB Medium 1 color map Language eng Type Text Coverage Walt Disney World Resort, Lake Buena Vista, Florida Epcot Center, Lake Buena Vista, Florida Disney's MGM Studios, Lake Buena Vista, Florida Fort Wilderness Campground, Lake Buena Vista, Florida Disney's Contemporary Resort, Lake Buena Vista, Florida Lake Buena Vista Resort Village & Spa, Orlando, Florida Downtown Disney Pleasure Island, Pleasure Island, Florida Spatial Coverage 28.385239, -81.563882 28.374686, -81.549411 28.357525, -81.558271 28.395725, -81.553689 28.414866, -81.574468 28.351952, -81.487423 28.371134, -81.518005 Temporal Coverage 1986-01-01/1986-12-31 Accrual Method Donation Mediator History Teacher Economics Teacher Geography Teacher Provenance Originally published by the <a href="http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/" target="_blank">Walt Disney Company</a>. Rights Holder Copyright to this resource is held by the <a href="http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/" target="_blank">Walt Disney Company</a> and is provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only. Curator Cook, Thomas Digital Collection <a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/">RICHES MI</a> Source Repository Private Collection of Thomas Cook External Reference Foglesong, Richard E. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/45420221" target="_blank">Married to the Mouse: Walt Disney World and Orlando</a>. New Haven: Yale University Press, 2001. Transcript Walt Disney World Road atlas for Cast Members 2 R's - Read'n & Rite'n 20,000 Leagues 24KT Precious Adornments Adventureland Adventureland Veranda America Gardens Theatre Americana Dutch Resort Arribas Brothers Warehouse Artespaña Aunt Polly's Avenue of the Stars Bath Parlor Baton Rouge Lounge Bay Lake Bear Island Road Big Pine Drive Big Thunder Mountain Railroad Bike Barn Bonnet Creek Drive Buena Vista Construction Company Buena Vista Medical Clinic Campfire Program Canada Cap'n Jack's Oyster Bar Car Care Drive Caribbean Drive Caribbean Plaza Carousel of Progress cast members Center Drive China Christmas Chalet Cinderella's Golden Carousel Circle-Vision 360 Columbia Harbour House CommuniCore Community Drive Contemporary Resort Country Address Country Bear Jamboree Cristal Arts Crockett, Davy Crystal Palace Davy Crockett's Canoes Diamond Jubilee Discovery Island Disney Inn Dopey Drive Dumbo Earth Station Empress Lilly Riverboat Enchanted Groves EPCOT Center Epcot Center Drive Fantasyland Fantasyland Dining Room Fatasy Faire Floridian Lagoon Fort Sam Clemens Fort Wilderness Campground Fort Wilderness Campground Resort Fort Wilderness Trail France Friendship Landing Frontage Road Frontier Way Frontierland Frontierland Railroad Statio Gateway to Scandinavia Germany Gourmet Pantry Grand Floridian Beach Resort Grand Prix Raceway Great Southern Craft Company Green House Hall of Presidents Haunted Mansion Heidelberger's Deli Hilton Horizons Hospitality House Hot House Hotel Plaza Boulevard Howard Johnson I-4 If You Had Wings Interstate 4 It's a Small World It's A Small World After All Italy Japan Journey Into Imagination Jungle Cruise Keel Boats Kennel Club KinderCare King Stefan's Banquet Hall Lake Bryan Lake Buena Vista Lake Buena Vista Village Lake Mable Liberty Square Liberty Tree Tavern Lite Bite Little Lake Bryan Little Lake Bryan Drive Live Oak Lane Mad Tea Party Magic Kingdom Magic Kingdom Drive Magnolia Golf Course Main Street Railroad Station Main Street U.S.A. Meadow Traiding Post Mexico MGM Studios Mickey & Company Mickey's Character Shop Mile Long Bar Mission to Mars Monorail Station Morocco Mr. Toad's Wild Ride Norway Odyssey Restaurant Palm Drive Palm Golf Course Pecos Bill's Cafe Peter Pan's Flight Pickett Suite Pinocchio Village Haus Pioneer Hall Pirates of the Caribbean Pleasure Island Polynesian Village Resort Pottery Chalet RCID Fire Department Reams Riad Reedy Creek Resort Wear Unlimited River Country Riverboat Landing road map Royal Plaza Sachet In Sassy's Sawyer, Tom Settlement Traiding Post Seven Seas Drive Seven Seas Lagoon Shoe Time Showcase Plaza Sir Edward's Haberdasher Snow White's Adventure South Lake Space Mountain Spaceship Earth SR 535 SR 536 Starjets Sun Bank Swiss Family Treehouse The American Adventure The Land The Living Seas Tom Sawyer Island Tom Sawyer Rafts Tomorrowland Tomorrowland Terrace Topiary Lane Town Square Town Square Cafe Toys Fantastique Trail Blazer Corral Tropical Seranade U.S. 192 United Kingdom Universe of Energy Village Gifts and Sundries Village Ice Cream Parlour & Bake Shop Village Lake Village Lounge Village Restaurant Village Spirits Viscount Vista Boulevard Vista United Telecommunications Walt Disney World Walt Disney World Village Wedway Peoplemover Station West Wilderness Road Windjammer Dock Shop World Drive World of Motion World Showcase Lagoon World Showcase Promenade