1
100
4
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https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/9758a30bbef0211d459a0125540b3451.pdf
c60e6d25aaa04eb52789bf35b14b4d1f
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project Collection
Alternative Title
Lone Sailor Collection
Subject
Veterans--Florida
Orlando (Fla.)
United States. Navy
Navy
Sailors--United States
Description
Collection of digital images and oral histories related to the former Recruit Training Center Orlando (RTC Orlando) for the United States Navy. The training center transformed raw recruits into highly effective sailors. This process took place over an intensive eight-week training period, commonly referred to as "boot camp." RTC Orlando occupied roughly one half of the former Naval Training Center Orlando (NTC Orlando), which was located at present day Baldwin Park, Orlando, Florida. Between 1968 and 1994, over 650,000 men and women graduated from RTC Orlando.
Contributor
<a href="http://www.lonesailorfl.com/" target="_blank">Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project</a>
<a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Is Part Of
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/24" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida.
Language
eng
Type
Collection
Coverage
Naval Training Center, Orlando, Florida
Contributing Project
<a href="http://www.lonesailorfl.com/" target="_blank">Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project</a>
<a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
External Reference
"<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">About the Project</a>." UCF Community Veterans History Project, RICHES of Central Florida, University of Central Florida. http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/.
"<a href="http://cfnavyleague.org/lone-sailor/" target="_blank">The History</a>." Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project. http://cfnavyleague.org/lone-sailor/
"<a href="http://rtcorlando.homestead.com/" target="_blank">The History</a>." RTC Orlando. http://rtcorlando.homestead.com/.
<a href="http://www.lonesailorfl.com/" target="_blank"><em>A Guide to Historic Orlando</em></a>. Charleston, SC: History Press, 2006.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Oral History of Richard Tobias Sloane
Alternative Title
Oral History, Sloane
Subject
Veterans--Florida
Navy
Orlando (Fla.)
Vietnam War, 1961-1975
Description
An oral history interview of Richard Tobias Sloane (b. 1934), who served in the U.S. Navy from 1964 to 1969, during the Vietnam War. Sloane was born in Queens, New York City, New York, on March 4, 1934. In August of 1964, he was commissioned into the Navy. Sloane served in Vietnam from September of 1967 to September of 1968. He also served on the USS <em>Rockbridge</em>, USS <em>Santa Barbara</em> in River Section 35, the USS <em>Garcia</em>, the USS <em>Wisconsin</em>, and the USS <em>Blue Jacket</em>. Sloane achieved the rank of Captain and earned a Purple Heart, Bronze Star with V Device, Legion of Merit, Combat Action Award, and Navy E Ribbon.<br /><br />This oral history interview was conducted by Carli Van Zandt on March 5, 2014. Interview topics include Sloane's background, joining the Navy, the USS <em>Rockbridge</em>, Officer Candidate School (OCS), the Vietnam War, Naval Training Center (NTC) Orlando, the Grinder, the USS <em>Blue Jacket</em>, airbases in Central Florida, the simulation industry, and the Lone Sailor Memorial Project.
Table Of Contents
0:00:00 Introduction<br />0:02:52 Background<br />0:01:58 Enlistment and USS <em>Rockbridge</em><br />0:05:44 Officer Candidate School<br />0:08:20 Graduation<br />0:09:53 Repair Division Officer<br />0:11:22 Vietnam War<br />0:18:09 Other assignments<br />0:21:52 Wife and children<br />0:24:18 Naval Training Center Orlando<br />0:27:11 Daily life and training at NTC Orlando<br />0:32:31 Advanced training at NTC Orlando<br />0:33:51 Central Florida airbases<br />0:35:39 Simulation industry<br />0:37:01 Hardest aspect, proudest moment, and memories from NTC Orlando<br />0:42:51 Leaving the Navy and keeping in touch with friends<br />0:45:22 Lessons learned, the lasting legacy of NTC Orlando, and the Lone Sailor Memorial Project
Abstract
Oral history interview of Richard Tobias Sloane. Interview conducted by Carli Van Zandt at the Education Building, Room 123, of the University of Central Florida in Orlando, Florida, on March 5, 2014.
Type
Moving Image
Source
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/VET/id/289/rec/1" target="_blank">Sloane, Richard T.</a>. Interviewed by Carli Van Zandt, March 5, 2014. Audio/video record available. Item DP0014912, UCF Community Veterans History Project, Special Collections and University Archives, University of Central Florida Libraries, Orlando, Florida.
Requires
<a href="http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/" target="_blank">Adobe Flash Player</a>
<a href="http://java.com/en/download/index.jsp" target="_blank">Java</a>
<a href="https://get.adobe.com/reader/" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a>
Is Part Of
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/109" target="_blank">Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project Collection</a>, UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection, RICHES of Central Florida.
Has Format
22-page digital transcript of original 50-minute and 17-second oral history: <a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/VET/id/289/rec/1" target="_blank">Sloane, Richard T.</a>. Interviewed by Carli Van Zandt, March 5, 2014. Audio/video record available. Item DP0014912, UCF Community Veterans History Project, Special Collections and University Archives, University of Central Florida Libraries, Orlando, Florida.
Conforms To
Standards established by the <a href="http://www.loc.gov/vets/" target="_blank">Veterans History Projects</a>, Library of Congress.
Coverage
Queens, New York City, New York
Officer Candidate School, Newport, Rhode Island
Mekong Delta, Vietnam
Naval Training Center Orlando, Orlando, Florida
Creator
Sloane, Richard Tobias
Van Zandt, Carli
Publisher
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Date Created
2014-03-05
Date Issued
2014-09
Date Copyrighted
2014-03-05
Format
application/website
application/pdf
Extent
432 MB
230 KB
Medium
50-minute and 17-second DVD aduio/video recording
22-page digital transcript
Language
eng
Mediator
History Teacher
Civics/Government Teacher
Geography Teacher
Provenance
Originally created by Carli Van Zandt and Richard Tobias Sloane.
Rights Holder
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Accrual Method
Item Creation
Contributing Project
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
External Reference
"<a href="http://cfnavyleague.org/lone-sailor/" target="_blank">The History</a>." Lone Sailor Navy Memorial History Project. http://cfnavyleague.org/lone-sailor/
"<a href="http://rtcorlando.homestead.com/" target="_blank">The History</a>." RTC Orlando. http://rtcorlando.homestead.com/.
<a href="http://www.lonesailorfl.com/" target="_blank"><em>A Guide to Historic Orlando</em></a>. Charleston, SC: History Press, 2006.
Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website)
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/VET/id/289/rec/1" target="_blank">Sloane, Richard T.</a>
Transcript
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. Well, thank you for coming today. I’m so glad that you made it.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>My pleasure.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Today is March 5<sup>th</sup>[, 2014] and I’m interviewing Mr. Richard Tobias Sloane, and he served in the United States Navy. Uh, we are doing this history project for the Lone Sailor Memorial [Project]. My name is [Carolyn] Carli Van Zandt, uh, and my cameraperson is Fernando Maldonado. We are interviewing Mr. Sloane as part of, uh, the Community Veteran History Project and Loan Sailor Memorial Project. Uh, recording here today, in the Education Building, Room 123—the conference room—in Orlando, Florida. Mr. Sloane, will you please begin by telling us a little bit about, uh, what branch of service you were in and your rank, uh, which you retired at?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I was in the United States Navy. I retired as a Captain in [20]06 in the United States Navy. Started my service in 1964 at the Officer Candidate School in Newport, Rhode Island.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Thank you. Uh, I’m going to get a little background information here. Can you tell us when you were born? Where you was born?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I was born on March the 4<sup>th</sup>, 1943. Yesterday was my birthday, so this is very appropriate. I was born in, uh, the Borough of Queens, New York City, in the State of New York.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. What did your parents do for a living?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>My father was a, uh—a wholesale merchant in dry goods in New York, on the lower eastside of Manhattan. My mother was a homemaker, and later in her life, she was in retail, uh, store sales in New York—in Long Island, actually.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Um, do you have brothers, sisters?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I have two older brothers. Uh, my oldest brother was retired Navy Captain also. He attended the United States Naval Academy—Class of 1957, and, uh, the middle brother, um, attended Harvard University, and Harvard, uh, Business School.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. Uh, would you tell me a little about how, uh, your family life may have impacted your decision to, uh, enter the Navy?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, there was no doubt in my mind that my oldest brother, who’s about seven years, uh, my senior, if you will, uh, attended the Naval Academy when I was young, uh, junior high school, uh, person, and watching him go through that academy for four years and then his, uh—the beginning of his military service definitely had an impact my decision to join the Navy. When I completed my studies at Boston University—and in 1964, the—the draft was still in effect—and the choices were to continue my education, at the time, or to be drafted, or to sign up for the service, uh, of my choice, and at the time, I picked that choice to be in the United States Navy. I didn’t realize, at the time, it would be a career choice, uh, but I enjoyed my early years in the service, such that I decided to stick around.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. So tell me more about, um, what impacted your decision to stick around.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I had a great first assignment. I came out of college at about 22 years old, uh—maybe even younger, at the time, and, uh, I was assigned to a ship called the USS <em>Rockbridge</em>—hull number APA-228, and that was a, uh—an amphibious troupe transport from the World War II era. Uh, the mission of the ship was to embark Marines—about 800 Marines—and associated cargo, and land on the shore in amphibious landings, and, uh, the, uh, manning of that ship—the Ward Room—if you will, the “Officer Car”—was made up with a lot of, uh, old timers, uh—warrants, mustangs as department heads. People who had been former enlisted[?], came up in the ranks, and they were sort of like—I don’t want to classify them as grandfatherly types—but they were very, uh, mature in there service, and, uh, the Commanding Officers of the ship when I was there, under which I had three Commanding Officers, were also senior Navy Captains who were on their way to major command and, uh, come[sic] out of aviation, and were going to head to larger ships, if you will. So again, they were very self-confident individuals, very accomplished people, and the younger officers, like myself, were all fresh, wet-behind-the-ears college kids, and so it was a very, very, um, engaging environment, um, a very learning environment, while, obviously, there’s a lot of pressure you to anything you do in that Navy environment.</p>
<p>It was such that you—you felt that you was learning, you felt like you were being mentored, uh, and I came away from that tour, uh, very, very, uh, personally fulfilled and—and feeling good about what I was doing. The sense of responsibility, that you got, which has always been, uh, something the Navy has played on for young beginners—that we’re going to give you, uh, tremendous responsibility that your peers, who were out working at Macy’s or selling insurance aren’t going to experience for a long, long time, and I found that to be true, because, uh, they give you things to do, and say, “Here’s a job. Go do it.” And they had enough faith in you to let you do it—to watch you close enough, so they wouldn’t let you mess up too bad. So it was a very, very good experience, as I look back on it over the years. I think that was principally what made me feel comfortable about staying in the Navy.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>You mentioned that you got this, uh, officer start before you did this first duty assignment through, um, Officer Candidate School, or OCS?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Correct.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Could you tell me a little bit about, um, what that experience is like?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, talk about the shock of your life. You come out of a university, a—very, uh, loving home, uh, environment, as I grew up. Um, so you leave the university. Again, you’ve had a sense of what service life might be like, because of my brother’s experience, but obviously, you really don’t know exactly what you’re getting into, and I remember, at the time, there was only a ferry that crossed from the main land over to Newport, [inaudible] Island, unless you wanted to go all the way up and around, by Fall River[, Massachusetts] and Providence[, Rhode Island]. Today, they have a bridge, but I remember on that ferry, as I reported for duty to go to OCS, and looking out over the water and said, what <em>have I done? </em>[<em>laughs</em>]. That sort of thing, because I didn’t know what I was headed for, but it was also a very, uh, broadening and lightening experience, because most of my childhood and my college experience, for the most part, was very, um—I forget what the right word is—but very, uh contained.</p>
<p>Uh, it wasn’t broadening. It was broadening educationally and, again, growing up in New York, you have a broadened sense of what life could be like, but I had never, uh, been in an environment with people from the South, people from the West, people from all sorts of cultures, uh—that sort of thing, and now you’re thrown into a barracks environment, uh, which is not quite the same as a college dormitory or fraternity house. Um, you’re—you’re being asked to do things in a very regimented way, uh, being held very, very responsible and accountable for the most minute, uh, daily life, uh, activities, and so while it wasn’t a shock, uh, it was certainly different. and it is a crash course, so your—things that, uh, people in NROTC [Naval Reserve Officers Training Corps] programs or Academy programs are getting years and years of time to, uh, uh acculture[sic] to and learn. You’re getting a crash course. It’s not that—it wasn’t that challenging or difficult, but you certainly had pay attention, and again, aside from the academics, the military side, um—it was just an enlightening experience. Mostly, in—in the exposure to people of different cultures, uh, uh, than ever before.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Graduation day.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Wow. You know, the funny thing was, uh, I can’t remember exactly—the whole program was about four months, and, uh, at about maybe three weeks before you graduate, uh, you get your orders, and the way you get your orders is, uh, you’re in a company of 30 men—maybe your class had a couple hundred in it, but, um—so you’re in a company of 30 men, and you get a—a message, if you will, to report to the barracks chief or the company chief at the company headquarters, and he’s going to tell you where you’re going, and I’ll never forget, he—he said—he said “Sloane, you’re going to the USS <em>Rockbridge</em>, APA228.” and I said, “Chief, what’s that?” [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p>I had no idea, because with all that indoctrination, I don’t think we ever got down into the grass as to ship types, you know? it was mostly here’s how you, uh, get from point A to point B, here’s how you do this, a lot of PT [physical training], uh, this, that, and the other thing, a lot of naval history. Uh, but I—I remember to this day, he told me where I was going, I had no idea what kind of ship it was or anything of that nature. So, uh, that was a little before graduation, but graduation day, you’re filled with pride, you have your ensign stripe[?], uh, and your off on a real, real adventure, you know? You’re glad to be leaving that environment, but you’re full of apprehension, because now, you’re going to be really entering the workforce, sort of to speak.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br />‘</strong>Kay. So you’re trained as a—a new ensign. What was your actual job as a new ensign?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, my first job, again, was in the engineering department, and I was the [Repair] Division Officer for the repair division. The Division Officer—you’re in charge of a group of enlisted men and—with a specific function—and their job was metalsmith and woodworking, if you will, on this ship. So, um, they were doing all that type of work. It was a small group. Uh, I was sort of fortunate and respected, instead of being put immediately in charge of a large division, which might’ve been at least 30 men or 40 men. It was small, compact.</p>
<p>Again, a lot of good leadership, you know? It’s always the Chief Petty Officer in the Navy who really knows what’s going on and runs the Navy. and especially when you’re brand new, I mean, you—even with what little book-learning you got, you have not a great idea on the technical aspects of what the people are doing, you’re worried about all the different aspects of being able to stand the watch, drive a ship, um, do your daily duties, oversee the people who are working for you—or working with you, uh,—that sort of thing, and again, it was a lot of—I don’t want to use the word “old timers”—but Senior Chief Petty Officers, uh, who had a lot of experience and confidence in their work, um, middle-grade Petty Officers. It was a good bunch. It was the right place for me to go for a start, because I had a lot of support from below.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Um, your early assignments—it sounds like you had a lot of on-the-job training, do you think it is because it was the Vietnam [War] era?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane <br /></strong>Well, uh, if you’re talking about the first ship, absolutely, you know? I mean, uh, at the time, a lot of people were going over to Vietnam. Uh, my second tour duty was in Vietnam, and by the time I have spent about two and a half years on that ship, I had, uh, changed jobs on the ship. I was, uh, made gunnery officer on that ship, which was—gave me an opportunity to learn another aspect of, uh, ship ward responsibility and duties, and so again, when I, uh, finished up that tour in about two in a half years, uh, I was very confident. I had, uh, been promoted one grade from ensign to Lieutenant Junior grade. Very proud, and, uh, left that ship with a great deal of confidence, I think.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Great. Um, can you tell me a little about your Vietnam experience?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I [<em>laughs</em>]…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>As much as you can.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, uh, absolutely. Um, Funny thing is, um: I—I mentioned earlier that I worked with these great people, you know? Uh, uh, as many warrants and LDOs [limited duty officers] who had maturity, a lot of experience, um, and how I got to Vietnam, I always thought was an interesting story. The Navy Bureau of Naval Personnel put out a newsletter about every month that they—a hard copy paper newsletter, and they went to every ship, and it—it really talked about what assignments were available to different people and different grade, what was happening in the personnel management area, um, and they came out with an article that said they were looking for Lieutenants Junior grade to be the Commanding Officers of LSTs, uh— “Landing Ship Tanks” —uh, to serve as mother ships for river patrol boats in Vietnam. So these LSTS would be at the mouths of the river, they would be the mother ship for 10 or 20 small river patrol boats, and they wanted Lieutenant JGs [Junior Grade] to be, uh, XOs. They wanted them to be XOs—Executive Officers, and I read that article, and, uh, my boss, at the time, was a Lieutenant, uh—LDO—an “old salt,” who I greatly admired, and he read that article. They were looking for Lieutenants to be Commanding Officers—Lieutenant JGs was to XOs to these LSTs, and he reads this article, and he says—he says, “Boy, I want to be a CO of a, LST.” And he said, “Rich, come be my XO.” You know, “We’ll go together.” I’ll—he’ll be the CO and I’ll be the XO of this LST.</p>
<p>Well, [<em>clears throat</em>] to go from being a Division Officer to an Executive Officer is highly unusual. Uh, but here is an opportunity, because it fit the mold, uh, of what they were looking for in Vietnam. I said, “Absolutely.” and I immediately wrote my detailer—the guy in Washington[, D.C.] who made these assignments—and—and, uh, I said, “I want to go be an XO on an LST, just like you wrote you needed, uh—uh, JGs to be XOs on LST. I want that job.” He wrote back—[<em>clears throat</em>] he said—corresponded back, “You know, you’re a little too junior,” because you’re in the JG billet for a number of years, uh—JG rank. Said, “You’re a little too junior, but we have lots of other jobs available for ya in Vietnam.” I said, “Okay.” I said, “But don’t give me a desk job. I want a job where the action is.” Next thing you know, I had a letters to a river patrol section that drove little plastic boats on the rivers of the Mekong Delta. So that’s how I got there.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Wow.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Yeah, I know, and then [<em>laughs</em>]—and then, my boss—I don’t think he ever got the job of CO. He did—he may have gotten an LST, but I don’t know that he had one off of Vietnam. Um, I spent a year. The tour that you got was a year. It was a small outfit—maybe a hundred people, if that. Uh, Most of them were assigned to run the boats, and the others were assigned as maintenance people. Uh, there was[sic], uh, two Lieutenants and three Lieutenants Junior grade, who made the officer structure. Then you had a number of Chief Petty Officers, and a host of, UH, other enlisted personnel, who manned the boats, and we spent a year patrolling the rivers of Vietnam.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>What impact do you think this experience had on you?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, it had a tremendous impact. Um, you know, you sad[sic] in the sense that you were at war. You were certainly, uh, aware of that. Um, I think it was Winston [Leonard Spencer- ]Churchill who said something like, “There is nothing more exhilarating than being shot at and missed.”<a title="">[1]</a> Uh, and I had that experience. Um, uh, we’ve lost a number of people from our section to combat, while I was there, and I respect—I consider myself fortunate that I—that I, uh, um, didn’t have a harrowing[?] experience that—that cost me more than it did, so to speak. Um, uh, it was interesting to be in country, in—in that environment—to meet people of Vietnam, um, in many different, uh, ways, if you will. Um, and that’s about it.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Do you think, um, your time through these, uh—the last two assignments that you just described help shape your leadership style?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Uh, yeah, I think to some degree. That’s hard to say, um, how you developed, what—what it was that caused you to develop your leadership. I think more, uh—I don’t know. I only speak for myself, but I think more it was my upbringing than anything else. There’s all sorts of leaders—different people. Some lead in fear, some lead in—in different manners, and I just think it was the way that I was brought up that really, uh, set the foundation for my leadership style. I think a lot of your style is not so much developed in those early years, but further as you go along, you get more responsibility. Certainly there was a lot of responsibility from day one at different levels, and—and very significant responsibility, but my impression was: the further along you got, the more leadership experience you had. You had the opportunity to observe other leaders, you know? The—the common phrase, as well, eh, you know; “I’m not going to do it like he did it when I grow up.” That sort of thing. So, uh, how you developed it is—is a, in my opinion—for me, at least, is a combination of a lot of things: my personal upbringing, the experiences that I had as you climb that ladder can really shape.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Thank you. What other, um, duty assignments did you take after your tour in Vietnam and prior to coming to NTC [Naval Training Center] Orlando?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Right. I came back from Vietnam and I was, uh, selected to go what then called the “Navy Destroyers School,”<a title="">[2]</a> which was really a course to prepare you to be a department head on a destroyer-type, um, ship. Um, that was a six-month course in Newport, Rhode Island. I met my wife there, during that time period. I courted her, eh, in—in those years—that time frame. Um, Went to USS <em>Garcia</em> DE-1040. Home-ported out of Newport, Rhode Island, as the Weapons [Systems] Officer.</p>
<p>Um, from there, uh, I have to think back. I went to the USS—oh, excuse me. From there, I went to, uh, instructor duty at what was then the beginning of the Navy Surface Warfare Officers School and served as an instructor to ensigns, who were coming from their commissioning source before they were going to surface ships, and, uh, that was about three-year tour in Newport, and then I went to USS <em>Milwaukee</em> AOR-2—I think it was. Homeport in Norfolk, Virginia, a multiproduct ship, uh, stationed out of Norfolk, Virginia. Great tour of duty, great, uh, shipmates there. Again, uh, a tremendous learning experience as a department head for the deck department. Uh, A lot of responsibility, a lot of work there. From <em>Milwaukee</em>, we went to shore duty in Millington, Tennessee—a little bit north of Memphis, where the Navy had its, uh, training headquarters, and, uh, I served on, uh, the staff of, uh, Naval Education and Training [Command] —technical training—in Memphis—Millington.</p>
<p>Uh, from there, after a short one year tour, um, I went to Hawaii, uh, to be, uh, Executive Officer on the USS <em>Hassayampa</em>, an oiler in, uh, Pearl Harbor, Hawaii. Another great tour. Uh, I think the, uh, thing that made my career so gratifying was the great shipmates and the leaders that I worked with over the years on these ships. From Hawaii, came back to Norfolk and served on the staff of, uh, Commander Carrier Group 8. Went to sea on aircraft carriers as a Surface Warfare Advisor, if you will—surface op[eration]s officer. Completed that tour, working for a couple of flag officers, and from there, let’s see. Where’d we go? [U.S.] Naval War College, I believe. Tour[?] in Newport, Rhode Island, at the Naval War College. A very int—interesting time, and then went to, um, command the USS <em>Santa Barbara</em>, uh, AE-28, out of Charleston, South Carolina. Was on board there for about two in half years, in command of the <em>Santa Barbara</em>. Went from there to, uh, the Executive Officer of Service Schools[sic] Command. [Naval Station] Great Lakes—very large training activity, uh, up in Great Lakes, Illinois, just north of Chicago[, Illinois], and from there, I came to Orlando, Florida, in command of the Service School Command Activity here at the Naval Training Center Orlando. So it was all in route, but we got there.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>That’s quite a list</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Yeah, I’ll say.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. This one’s about your wife. You ready for this one?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I’m sorry? Sure.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>This one’s about your wife. They say in the military, you great two for one. How did you do with the family, the military, and the traveling? How did she deal[?] with that?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, we were very fortunate. I’ve always felt that way. Um, my wife was ready, willing, and able for the adventure. She was a Navy nurse actually, when I met her when she was in college, and she was, uh, attending on a—a little bit of a scholarship at the end of her college tour, where, in exchange for tuition assistance, she went in the Navy as a Navy nurse, and in those days, if you became pregnant, they mustered you out, and so she was in for a little over a year in an half, until she became pregnant without first child, and had to muster out. So she had a little taste of the Navy, besides from the fact of growing up—not going up—but going to school in Newport, Rhode Island, as she did, which is where I met her, uh, she was exposed to all the Navy activity that went on in Newport, Rhode Island, at the time.</p>
<p>Um, so we enjoyed the Navy. Nobody enjoys leaving your family for six months at a time and Nowadays, sailors are leaving there families for even longer, but, uh, typical six-month deployment then was not something you looked forward to from a family standpoint-of-view, but she—she understood that and, uh, was a great Navy wife. You know, they say, uh, a Navy wife’s the toughest job in the Navy, and I believe it 110 percent, and our children, uh, my wife, and I always—we moved around a lot, you know? And describing where I went, it was here, there. We came back a couple times, but it was never back to back tours in the same town, and unlike some, who said, “Oh, I don’t want to leave Norfolk,” or “I gotta stay in San Diego[, California].” We were always up for that adventure, and after a year or two went by, the kids were always saying, “Where are we going next?” That sort of thing. Got a little tougher when they got to the junior high/high school age, but up ‘til then, they were always ready, willing, and able to—“Let’s find a new place to go.” And, uh, that was pretty good. I’d always come home, after having spoken with the detailer, getting the word on where we were going. Uh, I’d call home and say, “Honey, Are you sitting down?” And she knew that was the signal [<em>laughs</em>] that we were going somewhere. Yep.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Good. Um, well, what did you know about the region of Orlando and the military here?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I’m sorry.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>What did you know about the region of Orlando?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I didn’t know anything about it expect that they had a mirror of activity of Great Lakes on a smaller scale. Uh, Navy training activity, smaller in numbers, but the mission was basically the same, and I lobbied to get that job of Commanding Officer. I say lobbied. You know, I—you talked to your detailer and say “Hey. I hear there’s a job opening in Orlando. Uh, it seems to fit. I’m training in education subspecialist. I’ve done the tour as Executive Officer here. Um, and I hear the Commanding Officer tour for the Service School Command is open there.” I was fortunate to get that assignment, and again, uh, the only, uh—the biggest impression was if the kids were a little, uh, anxious in moving in that point in time, because they were in junior high [school] and getting little more into socializing. Uh, When I told them that we’d probably have a pool at the house, that settled the deal [<em>laughs</em>]. “Let’s go.” They were ready to pack and move—move down here. So I didn’t know much about it. That was it. Um, that was it.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>How long were you here at NTC Orlando?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, we got here in 1988, and I retired from that job in 1991. So…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>That was the tour.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Um, what were your overall impressions of the recruits and their training, during that time down [inaudible] your time at the base?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, I thought it was terrific. You know, I was—really, there were three activities. You had the Recruit Training Center, You had the Nuclear Power School, and you had Service Schools Command. So, uh, while we did have some interaction in between all those activities, um, the sailors that—that I was seeing, uh, who were coming, from the most part, out of boot camp—uh, We did have some coming to advanced schools, uh, from the fleet, but the majority of them are coming right out of boot camp—uh, just top quality, you know?</p>
<p>People have said that the quality of our servicemen and women today are—is better than ever, and they have said it for years and years, and I firmly believe it. A lot of people who say, “Ah, it’s not like the old Navy,” and they talk about things like uniforms and discipline, which is always important, but the, uh, quality, the intellect, uh, the upbringing—if you will—uh, of the people that[sic] are coming into the service, I thought was terrific, and I saw that throughout my career. You know, you’re in that moving stream, so you don’t always see the difference, but when you think about it, and you stop and you think, and you say, <em>Look at the quality of the Electronic Technicians School, who are going through Torpedoman [Mate] School</em>—some of these highly technical courses—You have to really, you know, learn some significant stuff or hone their skills. Um, we had top-quality people.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. Um, Daily life for your, uh, Navy recruits and your Navy sailors, that[sic] are there training for the schools—what was it like?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, again, the people that[sic] were in my school, for the most part, were brand new, coming from out of 8-12 weeks of Recruit Training Center. So you still had to be aware of their conduct more off the base than on the base. Remember, these are young people who been cooped up at recruit training, where they didn’t get any liberty for months on end, if you will. Now, they’ve been cut loose, so to speak. Uh, yes[?], you go to class, but you had your weekends off, sort of thing.</p>
<p>I think, on the whole, uh, and really across the board, we had very few discipline problems—things of that nature. Again, in a—in an organization that size, deal with that demographic, there will be individuals who really weren’t suited for the service, or who had a momentary lapse in judgment, shall we say, and so that’s typical in any large organization. I don’t think it—it’s not so visible in civilian—civilian life, you know? If some fella who’s working on the line in General Motors [Company] goes out and gets arrested for DUI [Driving Under the Influence], or something like that, General Motors doesn’t really hold him to task. Well, the military’s a little different on how it, uh, wants its people to represent the organization.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Uh,couple of, uh, questions here, uh, for those who—who don’t know. Could you explain to us what the Grinder was?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>What the what?</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>The Grinder was.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, the Grinder [<em>laughs</em>]. Well, I got very familiar with the Grinder at OCS, because the Grinder was where you—in OCS, you walked off punishment. I mean, it was the parade ground, and it was usually a paved a, uh—asphalt, uh, parade ground, uh, on which you’d have formal parades, but OCS—if you—if you didn’t make your bed right, or there was a dust bunny loose, or if your shoes weren’t shined, uh, when the other folks were going on liberty on Saturday, you were out there marching for two or three hours. Uh, And again, at—at boot camp, the Grinder was, again, the place where graduation was held, but again, uh, conduct infractions were marched off often times.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright, and, um, the purpose of the USS <em>Blue Jacket</em>?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Yeah, the <em>Blue Jacket</em> was, uh, a wooden replica, if you will, of a ship—a destroyer-type ship, and it had—internally, it had classrooms. Externally, it had fittings that you would find on, uh, a real ship. a life boat, or a whale boat, if you will, that could be lowered, raised, chalks, and bits, and lines, anchor chain, and halyards, and all the things that a sailor in—in the field of seamanship might encounter on a real ship, and so, uh, they can go on board that—that trainer, um, uh, and, uh, do the things that they would be asked to do out in the fleet, and they could also hold classes there. Uh, it was a—a fixture, if you will. A lot of people were sad to see it go.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. What kind of social life existed among the recruits on the base through the MWR—Morale, Welfare, and Recreation?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Right. Uh, the interesting fact is: when I retired from the Navy in 1991, uh, the first position I took as a civilian was director of the USO [United Service Organization], here in Central Florida, Which, in a sense, was responsible a little bit for the MWR. I mean, the base had its own MWR organization, which was really the root of it. Uh, when I was on active duty, I personally took advantage of it. They had great gym, and weights, and facilities, and pool—all those sorts of things that you would want on the base. They had opportunities for sailors to buy tickets to local events and theme parks—uh, the typical Morale, Welfare and Rec, uh, support system. The USO was there also, primarily to support, uh, the families that came to see the recruits graduate every week at—at, uh, the Naval Training Center, but, uh, the MWR ran some great programs. They always were there. I remember the people who were—for the most part, many were retired military who were running the programs. They had a golf course, which was, uh, one of the premiere, I think, spots in town, to play golf for the retired Navy community and active duty when they were on liberty. There was also a smaller course down by, uh—by the [McCoy] Air Force Base, or was then a civilian airport. They had a small place down there. They had camping gear you could check out. Um, Just, really great support. I think that was an asset for this—this community—the Navy community.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Um, did they have a local base newspaper?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>They did have a local base newspaper, and for the life of me, I’d have to think. I’d have to wake up at 3 in the morning to remember the name of it. I think it was <em>The Navigator</em> or something like that, and the fella named Jim Allen ran it, when I was there. He was sort of the—the editor. Uh, a great asset. I think it came out once a week, but Again, it covered the news, and all the good news, and, uh, that sort of thing. I—I got very familiar with the paper. I always wanted to make sure they—that if my activity had something to promote, it was in there, and it—they did a great job. It was a great asset.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br />‘</strong>Kay. After basic training, what other types of schools did you guys offer here at NTC?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Right. Well, Service School Command had four, uh, ratings, if you will—trade—Trade skills that they trained to. Uh, one was electronics technician, one was torpedoman, uh, one was quartermaster, and the other was signalman. So again we did that, and Nuclear Power School—they had two different, uh, schools, if you will: Nuclear Power A School, and I can’t for the life of me recall what the other division was called, but it was sort of like a lower division and an upper division, and their training, um—it went up to a lot of the skills and requirements of operating nuclear power plants. Uh, they had a lot of senior officers, who would go into command of nuclear powered ships, who went through that program. Very, very, uh, effective training program.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright, alright[?]. Um, did you have any shore maintenance that was done here? Did anything get sent back to have work done here locally for work done…</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>You know…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>From the ships?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>I don’t believe that we did. I think, um, most of any maintenance that went on was supporting, uh, what was happening at the base, uh—that sort of thing, but it wasn’t like equipment was coming back from the fleet</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Yeah[?].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>For maintenance.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zand<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Because that was all done at the fleet site’s shore locations, if you will.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>What about airbases? Uh, ‘cause we have airbases here. Were we doing any work for the airbase maintenance?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>No, again, the Navy, um—a lot of that air training was done in Memphis, where a lot of the air raidings were done in Millington, if you will.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Again, um, if you’re talking about, like, [Naval Air Station] Jacksonville, which had a Naval Air Station up there and added their own—their facilities up there. So we really weren’t training aviation raidings.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>So our airbases here had been pretty much downgraded?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Um…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>The old airbases?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, Naval Air Station Sanford became the Orlando-Sanford…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>[inaudible]?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Uh, International, uh, Airport. Um, uh, the Orlando International Airport was McCoy Air Force Base. Um, and, um, it’s always, uh, enjoyable when I drive down there and have a moment to scoot in by where the old [Boeing] B-52 [Stratofortress] is parked.<a title="">[3]</a> I think so many people in this community don’t know it’s there, haven’t had the opportunity to go down there where you can walk right up to it and kick the tires on this gigantic airplane. Up in, uh, Orlando-Sanford—which I’m sure the locals don’t know about—uh, there was a small civilian community, uh, that, uh decided to refurbish a [North American RA-5C] Vigilante, an A-5 aircraft, which is on display, uh, at the entrance to the airport up there. My wife and I had occasion to work with that committee and help, uh, put it in place, and, uh, that’s—that’s a sight, I’ll tell ya, and they’re working on refurbishing other aircraft for display up there.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Great[?].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Now, I know we had Tactical Air Command and Army Air Force[s] Training Command here, at one time. Did you have an occasion to work on any joint exercises with them?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>No, that was way before my time.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>That was when they wore the leather helmets.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>They have—the do still have the simulator training and stuff that goes on here with the [U.S.] Joint Forces [Command]? Did you…</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, the, uh…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Participate in any of that?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>The Navy—the, um, Naval Air Warfare Training Center [Systems Division]…<a title="">[4]</a></p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Here in Orlando, is part of the Research Park activity, the military’s presence, uh, joint services are there, mostly contracting for, uh, training and simulation work. That’s why all of these defense contractors have set up shop here in Orlando, so that they can have close act[sic]—access to those folks, but there’s a lot of activity taking on—taking in that area, right here in Orlando. Very important to the community.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Right. I know the, uh, base has tied to developing technology and simulations. Were you involved in any of the future simulation exercises that were currently…</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>No, really…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Conducted by the military?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>That all used to be located at the Naval Training Center, and, of course, as it expanded, uh, I remember—I can’t tell you the exact year, but it was when I was in service here that they built the [Luis] De Florez Center, here in the Research Park, and moved that operation out there, and grew it, and had just a tremendous expansion of not only that joint service activity out there, but again , the growth in the Research Park of defense contractors who have come here to Orlando, but I did not work directly with the training and simulation activities here.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Thank you. Um, what’s the hardest thing you remember doing while you were, um, a Commander at the NTC?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Pushups.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Pushups? [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] Yeah, well, you, um—I think “hardest” is a tough word. When you say “hardest,” uh, you know, I—I’ll change it over to what was the most, uh, difficult, uh, and that was the discipline. Um, Having to, uh, work with young people, who, again, had a lapse in—in judgment and came before you, because of some infraction—some minor, some not so minor, but it was always, I say, a little disappointment—maybe a little heartfelt, because it—in the back, you’ll say to yourself, uh, <em>This youngster can do better. </em>You’ve tried to provide them and your team to[?] guidance. Everybody makes a mistake, once in a while, and—and while there were those who, you know, were more than willing to atone for their sins, so to speak, and get back on track. Eh, there was the rare exception who was not the right person for the service and you had to ask them to leave, and, uh, I think—so when you say what was the “hardest,” it was that. You felt like to some degree, you failed. Now, some degree you—you can’t change some people—that sort of thing. So that was probably the most difficult, really.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Alright. From the most difficult, when did you feel the most proud at NTC?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I think, um, every time you had a graduation, you know? Uh, every time you set sailor from your school out to the fleet, and you felt that they were—your team had prepared them, uh, very well to do the job, and that they would go out, and the people in fleet were going to look back and say, “Now, that sailor came from NTC Orlando. He or she was trained right.”</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Um, is there a particular story, um, from your time at the NTC that you’ll never forget?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, there’s a million of them. A million of them. We used to—we had a lot of fun. I mean, if you don’t have fun—that’s not to say that every day was a good day, uh, but if you don’t come away, uh, with a balance sheet that says you had more fun than not, you’re probably either not doing it right or don’t belong there and, uh,every year, uh, the, uh, Navy-Marine Corps Relief Society would hold a fund drive. Navy-Marine Corps Relief Society is just what it sounds. It’s a[sic] organization—civilian organization—that, uh, provides release services for men and women in the Navy and the Marines who have had hardship. Whether it’s a house fire, a death in the family, some serious illness, they—they’re there to support with finances and services, if[?] necessary.</p>
<p>So every year they had a fund drive Throughout the Navy, and our little piece at the Navy Training Center broke down the individual commands, and what we did, for the time that I was there, we had a little carnival, or a cookout, or whatever every year in support of that, and my wife and I would put on a skit every year. So we did about three skits, during the time I was there, and [<em>laughs</em>]—and, uh, let’s see if I can remember them in the right order. One year, we did, uh a sk—it wasn’t a skit, but it was a song called “Lydia and the Tattooed Lady,” which [Julius] “Groucho” [Henry] Marx made famous, and I dressed up as Lydia the Tattooed Lady. My wife dressed up as Groucho Marx. The Navy band came and played the music.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>And out we went and did it for the crowd, and then one year, we did, uh, from, uh, <em>South Pacific</em>, uh—uh, the number “Honey Bun,” where—if you’re not familiar with it—this, um, senior sailor gets dressed up in a grass skirt and, um—and, um, uh, the Navy nurse dresses up as a sailor and sings about, uh, his girlfriend—his honey bun. So I dressed up in the grass skirt, and my wife dressed up in the sailor suit, and sang the song, and the Navy band played along, and then the last year we did, uh, “Get Me to the Church on Time” from <em>My Fair Lady</em>. So there I was in—in bridal regalia and she was, uh, dressed up as a, uh, groom going to the church, and we had great fun doing that. It made—let’s just say it made the base newspaper [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>That sounds wonderful.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Um, were there any other areas of the base that were of particular importance to you or the sailors?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, one of things, you—you know, everything was important, whether it was the commissary or what have you, but I remember Lake Baldwin, you know, which Baldwin Park is named after, if you will, and so many of the, uh, people who had the opportunity would go out there and fish on Lake Baldwin, or be at one of the clubs, whether it was the enlisted club or officer’s club, which looked out on Lake Baldwin. It was sort of, um, just the center of things, not necessarily geographically, but, uh, when you drove home, you went by it. That sort of thing. It was always there. The sort of Place a lot of people, uh, looked forward to seeing, or recreating on, what have you. The Maple Hospital overlooked Lake Baldwin. The golf course was off of Lake Baldwin. Uh, that sort of thing I remember very much.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Um, I know what you did when you left the Navy. You went to work for the USO. Do you recall the day your service ended?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>The day my service ended? Yeah. Well, you know, like most senior people in the service, they have some sort of retirement ceremony for you. Change of command is what it really was, where, um, uh—a good friend of mine, uh, Captain Harry Smith—U.S. Navy retired, still here in Central Florida, uh,—relieved me of that job, and that was a very emotional day. It may not have be the—my last day—maybe it was the last day. Uh, it was just, uh, a very emotional time for me, um, in concluding that service, and reflecting back on all the years of service, all the assignments, the family, uh that sort of thing. So that’s my reflection on my last day, if you will</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Have you kept in touch with people from the Navy?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, absolutely. Um, [<em>laughs</em>] there’s one warrant officer, uh, who served with me in Vietnam. He was the maintenance officer for the river section, and he, uh, sort of, uh, made it his business to stay in touch with, uh, those of us who were still around, and so, um, an email contact with him. As I said, Captain Smith, who relieved me of the Naval Training Service School Command job, um, was a good personal friend here. Dave Arms, retired Navy Captain, who was Commanding Officer of the [U.S.] Naval Reserve Center here in Orlando for a while, uh—still here, and, uh, we stay in touch. Um, you hear from some people every once in a while. One of the most poignant things I recall, uh, is: many, many, years went by, uh, after I had left Vietnam, and as I said, we lost a couple of people in our section, and I, over the years, received just a handful of correspondence from, uh, relatives of the people we lost, um, asking about them, and I responded to those people, and that was, in a way, staying in touch.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Was that hard?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, it—well, it was hard on—it wasn’t hard. Uh, I was glad to hear from them and to be able to tell them that, uh, their relative had served honorably.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Um, what values or characteristics do you believe that the Navy made, um—that instilled in you a great impression for the rest of your life?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I think discipline, and I—I mean that in the finest sense of the word. Organization, uh, good order, wanting to see things in the right place, um, making decisions, you know—right or wrong. Somebody’s gotta make that decision. Uh, working with others towards a common goal—that sort of thing.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Your lasting legacy with the, um, NTC in Orlando and the Navy’s legacy, um, in Central Florida—what do you think, um, is the lasting legacy in Orlando?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I think the lasting legacy [<em>sniffs</em>] is a couple of different things. One is: people, like myself, who are here and remain here, who chose to stay for many different reasons. Uh, but we have a tremendous veterans’ population here. People who served here and came back—I see a lot of that up in Sanford. You know, people—there’s a lot of, um, people who don’t, uh, know about the Naval Air Station Sanford, and, uh—and I had the opportunity to meet a lot of them during the restoration of the vigilante aircraft. Boy, they came out of the woodwork, um, for that, and so that’s one, uh—one thing. I think what we’re doing at—at, um, Baldwin Park, with the Lone Sailor Memorial [Project] is a great, great thing. Uh, that will stand forever and, uh, when generations go by, people will still know that there was a Naval Training Center activity here, hundreds and thousands of young men and women passed through here in service to their nation. Um, you can’t do more than that.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>How do you think that the former Navy personnel would like to see or reminded, um, at the memorial?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Well, I think that the Lone Sailor Memorial is a very, very appropriate, uh, recognition of what took place here over the years. I think, uh, there’s so much pride in—in veterans. I don’t care whether they did 20 years or a four-year hitch in the Navy. I have rarely spoken to an individual who served, especially in the Navy, uh, who didn’t come away saying “It was a good experience for me.” That sort of thing.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Okay. Um, when we’re looking at, uh, designing the [Blue Jacket] Park, what do you think they would like to see at the park?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Oh, nautical—Things of the nautical nature. I remember, when I [<em>laughs</em>] was, uh—had command at the Naval Training Center, and one of things, I think—my recollection of up at the Great Lakes is the—by—by virtue of the fact that it was a very, uh—I don’t want to use “old” in the wrong word—but it had been there for…</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Since 1903,<a title="">[5]</a> I think. They had accumulated a lot of maybe history there. Whether it was an anchor, or a gun, or what have you, and so as you walked around that base, if you will, a [inaudible] you saw a lot of these things And You knew you were at a military facility or a naval facility, and when I came to Orlando, one of things I asked my, uh, team to do was to bring some of those Navy artifacts to—to our activity, and I’ll never forget, uh, we brought two big—what we call “24-inch searchlights”—no longer in use in the fleet, but these, uh—If you see the movies and you see the big arc lights things searching for planes in the sky, and I, uh—I charged one of our officers. Uh, I said, uh, you know, “Get in touch with the—the old shipyards, who[sic] have this stuff in excess, and let’s see if we can’t get one.” They did. They brought it and it was mounted in front of the school. they got a, uh, uh, four-barrel—I think it was a 4-barrell—a 40-millimeter gun mount brought it down and got it there, and that was—when the base was closed, I think they transferred it, to my recollection, to the, uh, Oviedo High School and JROTC [Junior Reserve Officer Training Corps] unit, and they may still be there. I haven’t been in the back lot for a while.</p>
<p>So I think—and I remember that, uh, the torpedo—and it was a very strong World War II torpedo CO—submarine community here in Orlando, and I remember over at, eh, um—I don’t—it wasn’t near the USO, but it was somewhere over there in that vicinity, near the RTC [Recruit Training Center Orlando]. They had got these old World War II torpedoes and put them on display, and so I think, eh, you know, any of those type materials that can be brought, appropriately placed in and around Blue Jacket Park, uh, would really be a great reminder of, uh, the service that these people gave to their country.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Thank you.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>You’ve exhausted my list. Is there anything else you’d like to share with me?</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>Have a great Navy Day.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Aw.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>Thank you so much</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>You’re welcome.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>I appreciate your time.</p>
<p><strong>Sloane<br /></strong>My pleasure.</p>
<p><strong>Van Zandt<br /></strong>I’m ready to stop recording.</p>
<div><br /><div>
<p><a title="">[1]</a> Correction: “There is nothing more exhilarating than to be shot at with no result.”</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[2]</a> Correction: Naval Destroyers School.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[3]</a> B-52 Memorial Park.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[4]</a> Correction: Naval Air Warfare Center Training Systems Division (NAWCTSD).</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[5]</a> Correction: Naval Station Great Lakes was approved in 1904 and dedicated in 1911.</p>
</div>
</div>
A-5
advanced training
aircraft
airplanes
airports
auxiliary service
B-52
B-52 Memorial Park
Baldwin Park
basic training
Blue Jacket Park
Boeing B-52 Stratofortress
Bronze Star with V Device
BUPERS
Bureau of Naval Personnel
captains
Carli Van Zandt
Carolyn Van Zandt
Central Florida Research Park
Combat Action Award
Commander Carrier Group 8
Community Veterans History Project
conscription
CVHP
Dave Arms
deployments
destroyers
discipline
drafts
engineering
engineers
ensigns
Fernando Maldonado
Garcia
Get Me to the Church on Time
graduations
Great Lakes, Illinois
Grinder
Groucho Marx
gunnery officers
Harry Smith
historical preservation
historical restoration
Honey Bun
Jim Allen
Julius Henry Marx
Lake Baldwin
Legion of Merit
Lieutenant Junior
Lone Sailor Memorial Project
LSMP
LST
LTJG
Luis De Florez
Luis De Florez Building
Lydia and the Tattooed Lady
McCoy AFB
McCoy Air Force Base
Mekong Delta
memorials
military spouses
military training
military wife
military wives
Milwaukee
monuments
Morale, Welfare, and Recreation
MWR
My Fair Lady
NAS Sanford
Naval Air Station Sanford
Naval Air Warfare Center Training Systems Divisions
Naval Destroyers School
Naval Education and Training Command
Naval Training Center
Naval Training Center Great Lakes
Naval Training Center Orlando
Naval War College
Navy E Ribbon
Navy-Marine Corps Relief Society
NAWCTSD
NETC
Newport, Rhode Island
NMCRS
North American A-5 Vigilante
NTC Great Lakes
NTC Orlando
Nuclear Power School
nurses
OCS
Officer Candidate School
Officer Car
orlando
Orlando International Airport
Orlando-Sanford International Airport
parks
planes
preservation
Purple Heart
Queens, New York City, New York
RA-5C
RA-5C Vigilante
recruit training
Recruit Training Center
Recruit Training Center Orlando
recruits
Repair Division Officer
Research Park
retirement
Richard T. Sloane
Richard Tobias Sloane
river patrols
River Section 35
Rockbridge
RTC Orlando
Sanford
Santa Barbara
selective service
Service School Command
Service Schools Command
SERVSCOLSCOM
simulations
simulators
South Pacific
Surface Warfare Advisor
Surface Warfare Officers School
The Navigator
training
U.S. Naval War College
U.S. Navy
United Service Organization
USO
USS Blue Jacket
USS Garcia
USS Hassayampa
USS Milwaukee
USS Rockbridge
USS Santa Barbara
USS Wisconsin
veterans
Vietnam
Vietnam War
Vietnamese
volunteers
Ward Room
wars
Weapon Systems Officer
Wisconsin
-
https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/8484ca00e529b1952c08d4ac340f7380.pdf
890d365fab807170fe38306cbad1935f
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Vietnam War Collection
Alternative Title
Vietnam Collection
Subject
Vietnam War, 1961-1975
Veterans--Florida
Description
The Vietnam War was a Cold War Era "military conflict." The war was originally waged between Cambodia, Vietnam, and Laos. The United States became involved as a preventive measure to combat communism. The date of the war has been disputed, but a study in 1998 by the Department of Defense definitively put the start of the Vietnam War as November 1, 1955.
The first combat military troops 9th Marine Expeditionary Brigade didn't arrive until 1965. With the arrival of the combat troops came the first traditional battles of combat fighting in the war. During the Vietnam War, not only did American military go into battle with and for South Vietnam, the military also trained members of South Vietnam to fight alongside during the war. Peace talks were attempted, with France moderating, beginning on May 10, 1968. These talks were unsuccessful and lasted over three years.
The longest battle of the Vietnam War began on January 21, 1968 and didn't end until the U.S. reclaimed Route 9 on April 8, 1968, 77 days later. While the military conflict ended in April of 1975, it was a long process towards reunification and redevelopment as a country. The conflict left Vietnam in both political and economical ruins.
Contributor
<a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Is Part Of
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/24" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida.
Language
eng
Type
Collection
Coverage
Vietnam
Contributing Project
<a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a><span>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida</span>
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
Source Repository
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a><span>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida</span>
External Reference
<span>"</span><a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">About the Project</a><span>." UCF Community Veterans History Project, RICHES of Central Florida, University of Central Florida. http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/.</span>
Herring, George C. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/5126110" target="_blank"><em>America's Longest War: The United States and Vietnam, 1950-1975</em></a>. New York: Wiley, 1979.
"<a title="American Experience" href="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/vietnam/timeline/tl3.html" target="_blank">American Experience</a>." Public Broadcasting Company. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/vietnam/timeline/tl3.html.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
Scherer, Rose Marie "Judy"
Interviewee
McGuire, George G.
Location
University of Central Florida, Orlando, Florida
Original Format
1 audio/video DVD/CD
Duration
43 minutes and 22 seconds
Bit Rate/Frequency
157kbps
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Oral History of George G. McGuire
Alternative Title
Oral History, McGuire
Subject
Veterans--Florida
Orlando (Fla.)
Vietnam War, 1961-1985
Air Force
Army
Description
An oral history interview of George G. McGuire, who joined the U.S. Air Force in 1963 and served until 1983. He was born on Summit, New Jersey, on October 17, 1941. A veteran of the Vietnam War era, McGuire achieved the rank of Lieutenant Colonel.<br /><br />This interview was conducted by Judy Scherer on April 1, 2014. Interview topics include McGuire's background and family, his college education, join the Air Force Reserve Officer Training Corps (AFROTC), Whiteman Air Force Base, McCoy Air Force Base, duties as a procurement officer and a contract administrator, the Defense Contract Administration Services, serving in Bangkok during the Vietnam War, the U.S. Air Force Office of Special Investigations (USAFOSI), the Rock Island Arsenal, military retirement, U.S.-Thailand relations, and his many travel experiences.
Table Of Contents
0:00:00 Introduction<br />0:02:33 College years<br />0:03:06 Air Force Reserve Officers' Training Corps and Whiteman Air Force Base <br />0:04:42 McCoy Air Force Base<br />0:05:42 George Washington University, Defense Contract Administration Services, and Bangkok, Thailand<br />0:07:05 U.S. Air Force Office of Special Investigations<br />0:14:55 Assignments in the United States<br />0:15:33 Bangkok and Mom Rajawongse Seni Promoj<br />0:21:45 Duties as a Contract Administrator<br />0:23:24 Interesting people and stories from Thailand<br />0:28:06 Communicating with family<br />0:30:23 Communicating with Thais<br />0:35:50 Visiting South Korea with his wife<br />0:39:42 Closing remarks
Abstract
Oral history interview of George G. McGuire. Interview conducted by Judy Scherer at the University of Central Florida in Orlando, Florida.
Type
Moving Image
Source
<a href="http://stars.library.ucf.edu/veteransoralhistories/269/" target="_blank">McGuire, George G.</a> Interviewed by Judy Scherer, April 1, 2014. Audio/video record available. <a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, RICHES of Central Florida, University of Central Florida, Orlando, Florida.
Requires
<a href="http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/" target="_blank">Adobe Flash Player</a>
<a href="http://java.com/en/download/index.jsp" target="_blank">Java</a>
<a href="https://get.adobe.com/reader/" target="_blank">Adobe Acrobat Reader</a>
Is Part Of
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/92" target="_blank">Vietnam War Collection</a>, UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection, RICHES of Central Florida.
Has Format
Digital transcript of original 43-minute and 22-second oral history: <a href="http://stars.library.ucf.edu/veteransoralhistories/269/" target="_blank">McGuire, George G.</a> Interviewed by Judy Scherer, April 1, 2014.
Conforms To
Standards established by the <a href="http://www.loc.gov/vets/" target="_blank">Veterans History Projects</a>, Library of Congress.
Coverage
Summit, New Jersey
Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Fawley, England
Durban, South Africa
Statue of Liberty, Liberty Island, New York City, New York
University of Notre Dame, Notre Dame, Indiana
Whiteman Air Force Base, Missouri
McCoy Air Force Base, Orlando, Florida
George Washington University, Washington, D.C.
Defense Contract Administration Services Management Office, Naval Air Station Sand Point, Seattle, Washington
Chokchai Building, Bangkok, Thailand
Armed Forces Staff College, Norfolk, Virginia
Washington, D.C.
Yokota Air Base, Fussa, Japan
Rock Island Arsenal, Rock Island-Moline, Illinois
Warsaw, Missouri
Osan Air Base, Pyeongtaek-si, South Korea
Seoul, South Korea
Creator
McGuire, George G.
Scherer, Judy
Publisher
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Date Created
2014-02-22
Date Issued
2014-09
Date Copyrighted
2014-02-22
Format
video/mp4
application/pdf
Extent
358 MB
257 MB
Medium
43-minute and 22-second audio/video DVD/CD
27-page digital transcript
Language
eng
Mediator
History Teacher
Civics/Government Teacher
Geography Teacher
Provenance
Originally created by Judy Scherer and George G. McGuire and published by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>.
Rights Holder
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Accrual Method
Item Creation
Contributing Project
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
Source Repository
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
External Reference
Herring, George C. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/5126110" target="_blank"><em>America's Longest War: The United States and Vietnam, 1950-1975</em></a>. New York: Wiley, 1979.
Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website)
<a href="http://stars.library.ucf.edu/veteransoralhistories/269/" target="_blank">McGuire, George G.</a>
Transcript
<p><strong>Unidentified<br /></strong>We’re ready.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Are you saying go?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] Today is April the 1<sup>st</sup>, 2014. I am interviewing, uh, Lieutenant Colonel George G. McGuire. My name is [Rose Marie] “Judy” Scherer. Uh, please call me Judy. Um, his interview is being conducted at UCF [University of Central Florida] in Orlando, Florida. It is part of the UCF, um—the whole title is—is Community History Project—[Community] Veterans History Project. Um, so we are going to start with, um, the early days. I would like to ask you where you were born and grew up.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Alright. Well, I was born in New Jersey—Summit, New Jersey. And When I was, uh, a few weeks old, my family moved on to Baton Rouge[, Louisiana].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Wow [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Where my father worked in the oil refinery at Baton Rouge during World War II, and where I managed to acquire twin brothers and a sister.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Um, Shortly—well, not shortly. When I was about eight years old—eight or nine years old—we moved to England.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Where my father was building an oil refinery at Fawley, near South Hampton, for Esso in England. After we had been there about three years, we moved to Durban, South Africa.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Wow.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Where he was again a resident engineer for construction of an oil refinery—first one on the continent of Africa—and where I acquired a brother. I had acquired another sister in England, and now I had a brother in South Africa, so there are six children.</p>
<p>We sailed back to the United States. This is now approximately 1954 on a ship called the <em>African Enterprise</em>, which was a, um, freighter—combination freighter and passenger ship that carried a few passengers. And we were the only children, so we had the run of the ship.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And that was great fun. We got back to, uh, New York in the middle of the wintertime. And my memory says it was in February, but that may not be right. And of course, being good loyal little Americans who had been out of the country for so many years, we had to stand up on the ship and watch Miss [the Statue of] Liberty as we came into New York Harbor.</p>
<p>Uh, following that, we lived in New Jersey for a number of years. And then I went off to college at the University of Notre Dame. And shortly afterwards, my father quit his job and moved to Massachusetts.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And, uh, the bane of my life was that when I would go home for vacation to a place in Massachusetts surrounded by girls’ colleges, they all had vacation break at the same time as we did.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So there was nobody there.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And of course, Notre Dame at that time was all men, and there were no women there, unless we found some in the local community, which was a very difficult thing to do.</p>
<p>Uh, At Notre Dame, they had three R—all three ROTC [Reserve Officers' Training Corps] programs. This is 1959 when I started there. There’s a shooting [Vietnam] War going on in Asia. People are being drafted. I had no interest in being drafted and being given a rifle and go shoot people, so I said <em>Okay. I’d rather be an officer. And no, I don’t want to walk around in the mud, and I don’t want to sit on a boat bobbing up and down in the ocean. And since you have Air Force, I will go Air Force.</em></p>
<p>Um, so I did. And when I was graduating Notre Dame, I was commissioned as a Second Lieutenant in the United States Air Force and promptly sent to Whiteman Air Force Base in Missouri.</p>
<p>So one of the first things I did was I bought myself a car. I didn’t have a car at that point, so I brought a brand new, shiny red Valiant convertible. And that was a neat looking car. I shaw—showed up on base, and went into my first assignment, and the people I’m working with—one of them takes one look at that car and says, “I give you one year.”</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh huh. And, uh, he turned out to be right. Because a few months later, I met a young lady, and less than a year later, we were married. All fault is directed at that shiny red convertible, I suppose.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>About a year or so after we were married, I got orders to transfer to McCoy Air Force Base, which, of course that’s a hardship tour to come to McCoy Air Force Base, which is now Orlando International Airport, where I was the base procurement officer here.</p>
<p>Now, they had assigned me to procurement when I went to Whiteman, and I didn’t know what “procurement” was. I only knew one meaning for the term, and it had more to do with what you did after hours than it did with buying anything the Air Force wanted. Anyway, I became procurement officer. “Procurement” just simply means that you’re the guy in charge of going out and buying stuff.</p>
<p>So I was stationed here in McCoy, and, um, about that time, is when what was then called “Orlando Air Force Base” is transitioning to the Navy. And the last Air Force unit to transition out from Orlando Air Force Base was the hospital. So my two sons have the distinction of having been born in an Air Force hospital on a Navy base.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>From here, the, uh, Air Force sent me up to Washington, D.C., to go to George Washington University for a Master’s Degree in Business Administration, as my assignment for a year and a half. And then from there, to go to Seattle, Washington, to the, uh, Defense Contract Administration Services management area Office, otherwise known as DCAS.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Excuse me. What was it known as?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>DCAS. D-C-A-S.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>S.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Judy had a problem with this one earlier.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Which was at, um, Sand Point Naval Air Station, which was a little pimple on the side of the wealthiest area of ci—city of Seattle, a few blocks away from the University of Washington. Not very far from it. It no longer is a military installation. It’s now high-cost residential.</p>
<p>Um, let’s see. from there, the next assignment was to Bangkok, Thailand, to be the, uh—one of the officers assigned to the Air Force’s Procurement Center in Downtown Bangkok, which was supporting all of the Air Force and some of the Army units, uh, throughout Thailand and, uh, Vietnam. And this is at the tail end of the Vietnam War.</p>
<p>From there, I went back to the United St—came back to the United States to go to uh, Norfolk, Virginia, to the Armed Forces Staff College.</p>
<p>And then from there, to the, uh, Air Force OSI—Air Force Office of Special Investigations—in Washington, D.C., to act as an in-house consultant on procurement matters. Air Force OSI had been founded la—years before, in the very early days of the Air Force, because of scandal having to do with contracting. And then they had gotten away from that and they had forgotten had to spell “contracting.”</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>As they got mostly inter—interested in chasing drugs. But in, um—somewhere around 1970, there was another big scandal that came up that didn’t have anything to do with the Air Force, but it did with the Navy. And the Air Force decided that it would be smart to get back into that business and pay attention, because we are spending just huge sums of money. We ought to be paying attention to it. And the first thing they needed to do was to find somebody who knew something about the procurement system and could come in and act as an in-house consultant to them, and so they chose me.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Really?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So for two years, I taught OSI agents how to spell “procurement” and the kinds of things to look for. The big thing coming out of it was to find out just how honest the system really is at that level. There may be corruption at other levels, but at the level of the working people doing the job, it is a very, very honest system.</p>
<p>Um, now what did I skip? Somewhere in here, I skipped something. No. I guess not. When that was finished, they sent me to Japan to be the Deputy Director of the Air Force’s Procurement Center in Tokyo—actually, at Yokota Air Force Base,<a title="">[1]</a> which is just in the western suburbs of Tokyo—in which I had the responsibility for all of the, um, in-country support for Air Force and Army, and staff responsibilities towards the, uh, Army Center—similar to it in Korea, that took care of Air Force and Army in Korea.</p>
<p>And, uh, let me think for a moment. Oh, yes. One of the, um, cases that I had run in the OSI had been an accusation made against the Lieutenant Colonel who commanded the Air Force Procurement Center at Yokota Air Base—that he was corrupt, and that he was accepting bribes from, uh, one of the car companies , which the, uh, U.S had a contract with for small engines.</p>
<p>Well, the truth of the story—it turned out, that the man was an elder of the Mormon Church,<a title="">[2]</a> as well, as being a[sic] Air Force officer. And he had led a church group on a visit to the plant. Just a visit to go see what the plant looks like. And his big mistake: when he got back to his office was he had written the thank you note on Air Force letterhead, rather than on Mormon Church letterhead. And that had kicked off all of these accusations that he was, uh, a corrupt and on the take from this car company, which of course, he was not. But we had spent a bunch of time going and checking it out, so I knew all about it [<em>laughs</em>] before I got there.</p>
<p>Um, then that was followed by an assignment back in the United States to go to Rock Island Arsenal [in Rock Island-Moline, Illinois] to be the Deputy Director of the ammunition procurement division for U.S. Army Armament Material and [the U.S. Army Military Intelligence] Readiness Command, functioning as something called “Single Manager for Conventional Ammunition.”</p>
<p>Army buys all the ammunition used by the military—all production ammunition, not development, but production—ammunition used by the military, of whom the Air Force was the second largest consumer. And therefore, the Air Force, to help with that mission, sent six officers to Rock Island to participate. And at th—this point, I am a Lieutenant Colonel. And so I became the Deputy Director of that division. We spent in that one division—and this is 1980—one and a half billion…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>gasps</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Dollars a year. This is peacetime. One and a half billion. Buying bits and pieces of little things, most of which costs less than one dollar a unit, and the most expensive one was ten dollars a unit. All over the country. And then, the things we bought would flow to the Army load plants to be made up into rounds of ammunition—most of them. And they spent another billion and a half or so putting the stuff together as ammunition.</p>
<p>Okay. So I’m making decisions every day about how am I spending one and a half billion dollar budget. I’ve got a hundred people literally working for me. Uh, we are loading plants all over the country. We are making decisions about which factories we keep in business and which ones we don’t, and which communities stay in business because the factory’s there, and which ones don’t. And then I go home, and I have to be concerned if there was enough money in the checking account for my wife to go grocery shopping.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Whoa. A great[?] contrast.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>This got a little bit mind-bending at times.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Quite a contrast.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Hm?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Quite a contrast.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Quite a contrast. Yeah. And then, uh, I retired.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>At this point. I had been in the Air Force for 20 years and three weeks</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And I decided it was time to go. I had three kids that needed to go to college, and they weren’t going to do it on Lieutenant Colonel’s pay, so I had to go do something else.</p>
<p>And another interesting thing, to me at least, was that I had joined Air Force ROTC back there in college, because I had no desire to be anywhere near the Army or the Navy, but especially the Army. And so for my final tour of duty, I am winding up serving with the Army</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>As one of their officers [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /> </strong>Anyway, so that’s it.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>What—when were you serving for the Army? Was that duty procur—procure—procurement, or was that when you [inaudible]?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No. That was with the Army. I was Deputy Director…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>For Ammunition Procurement.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Deputy Directory of Ammunition Procurement Division of that Army command.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, it all is very impressive, and I’m sure it was most important, but it sounds to me like your career was drug[?] running and buying guns [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh, no. actually…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Just joking.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>I might have bought some drugs along the way.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>To find out where [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But they would have been legal ones.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Um, Never bought any guns. Never bought an airplane, but I bought just about everything else.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, when you were doing procurement, the rifles—what were you actually…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, I didn’t buy the rifles. I bought the ammunition that went in the rifles.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, you bought the ammunition. Sorry. Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Somebody else bought the rifles.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, you [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>There was another group doing that.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And there was another officer.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Other officers assigned to that.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer</strong>So you said you were in Bang—so—so you said you were in Bangkok</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And then you were in Thailand—I mean, Thailand is Bangkok.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And other places, but um, did you—did you do anything in the states? How long were you in the states at the end of the career?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Well, it was three years in, uh, Rock Island.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>It was three years at McCoy Air Force Base.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So two years in Whiteman’s. So that’s at least eight years of doing procurement there. And it was two years in the OSI, advising the OSI people about procurement—participating in, uh—in their actions.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Could you enlarge a little about your stay in Bangkok, and tell us more about what you did, and how difficult or easy it was? Because of the place, of course, it is always very hot there. [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yes. As we were talking earlier, if you got a, um, weather report for Orlando and a weather report for Bangkok, for the months of July, August, and September, you could not tell the difference as to which city you’re reading the report on. It’s the same.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Interesting.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>The difference is, of course, that Orlando does cool down—some. Bangkok doesn’t. The, uh—Bangkok only has, um, three temperatures—hot, hotter, and hellatious.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh, Bangkok was a very interesting and very, very different, uh, type of assignment. At that time, the Air Force’s procurement office was in a building in the center of Bangkok. It was called the “Chokchai Building,” and it, uh—it wasn’t terribly tall. My memory says seven floors, but it might’ve been more. Uh, the city was built on swamp, so the building was constructed such that it floated. And its basement was a big concrete barge, and it was floating. Now, the technology has progressed, and you go to Bangkok, and there are skyscrapers all over the place. It’s a fairly modern city, but at that time it was not.</p>
<p>And, uh, so I was there as one of the officers assigned to that position. My memory says there were four of us, at that point, and I was the fifth one kind of detached. And, um, we just bought all the goods and services that the U.S. Air Force required in Thailand. And at that time, we had several bases scattered all over Thailand. And we had, um, people working for us—enlisted, uh, men—working for us at each base, also during procurement, but they were doing it as our subordinates for the stuff that had to come really from the local community. But otherwise, uh, we would buy the stuff in Bangkok—things in Bangkok. And this would be stuff—oh, it would be food, it would be entertainment, it would be the gas for the propane heaters, uh.—you name it. We would be buying it in Bangkok.</p>
<p>Um, We lived in a, uh compound, which was very much like a park, that was a little ways away from the, uh—from the office. And, uh, you walked in there and it was a beautiful little park-like area. It was lined with houses, all of which are rented to, uh, foreigners, like ourselves. Either American or Australian or somebody else, or the, uh, members of the diplomatic corps. And at the front of the—of the property, there was a very old, interesting Thai gentleman, and at the back of the property was his son and his family. And the fellow at the front—named [Mom Rajawongse] Seni Pramoj.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Seni Pramoj? [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Seni Pramoj. Now Seni Pramoj is rather important in Thai-American relations. In World War II, the Japanese moved into Thailand, and Thailand declared war on the United States.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I never [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Seni Pramoj was the ambassador in Washington, D.C. He refused to deliver the declaration of war. United States chose to ignore it. When WWII ended, the United States chose—says, “Thailand was not an enemy combatant. They were an occupied country.” Other Allies had different opinions, and there’s[sic] arguments about it. And so the United States agreed, “Okay. We would take a little, tiny bit of reparations. We ‘ll take one house.” And it became the residence of the American Ambassador.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>That’s a fascinating story.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Seni Pramoj later was president of Thailand…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, really?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>At one time or another.<a title="">[3]</a></p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But at the time we met him, he is the landlord, sitting up at the front of the compound.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh[?].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And we didn’t see him very often, but we did—knew who he was. But, um…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I thought you were going to say he was the watchman. You know, because [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No. We figured that the—there was very little obvious security in that compound. There was no real guard at the gate or noth—but there were gardeners all over the place, and we figured they were all Thai CID [Criminal Investigator's Department].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>]Well, one of them was very important.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And, uh…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And I—I think that’s a story that is well worth recording, because it shows how a war was, uh—was, um, avoided by simple, you know…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah, um…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Simple contacts.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So, America has been—had a treaty of friendship with Thailand since 1835, or something like that. It was the first one we signed with anybody in Asia.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, that’s interesting. [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>‘Course, at that time, I think Thailand was probably about the only independent Asian country that we could get into. Japan was closed. China was, uh, occupied by several people. The—the British had Burma<a title="">[4]</a> and Malaya, And Dutch had Indonesia, and the French had Cambodia and Vietnam. And Thailand was in the middle. And we signed a treaty of friendship with those folks.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>which I think has paid off very handsomely for us.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Too bad it’s so unique.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And it’s very unique.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>During the, um, Vietnam War, Thailand actively participated in the war. And Thailand provided us with access to their facilities, and that’s the only time they have ever done that for anybody that’s not Thai.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes[?]. [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So, um, [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I wish—wish they had done the same thing in Vietnam.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Well…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>You know, after [Ngô Đình] Diệm [inaudible]. But I’m supposed to ask you questions, and you answer at length</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah. So…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And I ask very short questions, but you’re asking at length very well [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>One of the…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>So I don’t have to ask you many questions.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>One of the jobs I had, while I was there in Thailand, was to be the Contract Administrator for the Thai security guard contract. We employed…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>That sounds like a Chinese title. It’s so long.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Almost.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Can you say it again?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Thai security guard contract. To be the contract administrator. We had a contract, and it was written as a regular Air Force Procurement contract, between ourselves and the [Thai] Ministry of Defense, whereby they provided, uh, Thai military reserves to act as the security guards for all of our forces—our locations, rather—all over the country of Thailand.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Interesting.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Every little—every U.S…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Space. Now, some of those were big. They’re big air bases. There’re lots of people. And some of them were little tiny listening posts…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Out in the jungle…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Wow.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>With maybe one or two Americans—well, usually more than that—maybe four Americans, and four or five Thai security guardsman to take care of them, to keep them safe, and literally keep the tigers from coming into the, uh…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Into the post.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Mmhmm. That’s unusual.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah, and part of my duties were[sic] to go and inspect every one of those installations all over that country to make sure people are doing the job right.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Which I did.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes. I’m sure you…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Which was a very interesting [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I’m sure you did it very arduously, but it sounds very interesting.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>It was. It was very interesting.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh, so where do we go next?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I want to ask you if you, in all—in all these different places you’ve been, if you met any characters that stay—stayed in your mind as being particularly interesting, either, you know, um, good, bad, or eccentric, or whatever?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Hm. Strange…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Because your experiences are so different from other people’s in the military.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Usually[?], they’re in a unit, or they’re on some ship, and so on. But you were all over the place with all kinds of people, from the important ones to the not-so important ones.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah, but some of them were just ordinary folk. Uh, like[?] I was. [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>But you had to find people who spoke English, I presume.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yes. And in most of the world, you can get by on English.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>That’s true.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Most educated Thais could speak some English.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>The, uh, officers on the Thai side, with whom I interfaced—one was an Admiral, the other was an Army Major, uh—spoke—spoke beautiful English.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes[?].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Um…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>That was—your stories are so interesting.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>That…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Can you tell another story that—of interest…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>From that…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Well, there is one other one of interest from that. I went to one of the bases, and the, uh—the guardsmen work on the base. They work for the American, uh, military police chief, whoever he is. And so, I was talking to him one day, and he was telling me about a young airman who wanted to get married. Now, before a serviceman can get married overseas, especially in a warzone, his, uh, bride has to be vetted through the American Embassy.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And most Americans, when they look at a Thai woman, cannot tell how old she is…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Until she is elderly, and then it’s obvious that she’s elderly. But as long as she is fairly young up through middle age, you’ve got no idea how old she is, when you look at her.</p>
<p>So there was this, uh, one young fellow, who wanted to get married and this—this is, um—now, this is 1974 time period—to, uh, his Thai honey. And when they started checking on her, they found out that she had been a prostitute for the Japanese forces, when the Japanese had occupied this particular base 30 years earlier.</p>
<p><strong>Unidentified<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Very interesting turnaround[?].</p>
<p><strong>Unidentified<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] So our 18 year old—18 year old…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>American G.I. couldn’t tell she was probably 45.</p>
<p><strong>All<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Interesting. That’s interesting story.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Do you have friends around the world that you made at that time?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>We did have for a long time, but then, um, over the years…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>They’re gone. The Admiral that[sic], uh, had been in charge from the Thai side—I kept in touch with for a long time, but then he died.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I’m not supposed to add anything to this, but I have to say that a prostitute who was a prostitute for the Japanese was[?]—was, uh—was quite often recruited and kept as a slave for soldiers.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, more than likely.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>What did they call them? There’s a name for them. But anyway…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh, comfort girls.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer <br /></strong>Comfort girls.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Or comfort women, rather.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>She—that could have happened to her. I mean, but still, she was old.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>It might have been.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But the point of the story wasn’t so much that she’d been a prostitute.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>That she was old.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>It was that she was at least 45 years old…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And our 18 year old airman couldn’t tell.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] That would’ve been an interesting—or a—have made a rather easy decision for the superior to make [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yes. I don’t think she got her clearance.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] So do you—yeah. Do you keep in touch with anyone that[sic] was posted in those places with you?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No. By now, I have lost—well, with all, except one. I still keep in touch with the man I worked for when I was in Japan.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But, uh…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>The rest of them, time has gone by.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Tell us about more colorful characters you’ve met.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>ike, I don’t, uh—Well, one of the most colorful characters was a fellow out there when I was a Thailand—American officer, who had lost the, um, first two joints of[?] one of his fingers, through some kind of accident. He cut it off with a saw or something. It wasn’t—it wasn’t particularly interesting. But the thing was he only had that much. Now in Thailand, you bargained at that time. You bargain for everything, and—but the currency is baht. So we would go and we would say, “Four baht,” and “Five baht,” “Ten baht.” whatever. Well, he could bargain in half baht.</p>
<p><strong>Unidentified<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] I see why you remember him.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>That’s my main memory of him, is he could bargain in half bahts.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I’m going to ask you a two-step question. Number one: did you ever keep a diary or make notes of what you were doing? Um…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, that’s [inaudible]—that’s more or less the answer then. Because, uh, it would be interesting, and you probably would have forgotten by now some of the things. Some of the [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, I’m sure I’ve forgotten probably most of it by now.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But no. I did—never kept any diary. I got movies and slides and stuff like that, but…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>So what about your family, that were in the states whilst you were doing all this? Did you keep in touch with them fairly well?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Well, my family was with me.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>No. Not your immediate family. I mean, your…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Parents and siblings[?].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>My parents, and my brothers and sisters and siblings?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>I still do keep in touch with them.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Now, my parents are long gone, but yeah. My brothers and sisters and I still keep in touch.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, of course, we didn’t have email or anything, so what did you do? Write to them?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah. We write—wrote letters. And every time you circulated that through the country, you would, um, go and see people. Um, yeah. My wife’s, uh, parents lived in War—in Warsaw, Missouri, which, uh, is kind of south and west of Kansas City[, Missouri]—a couple hundred miles out in the country at the head waters of the Lake of the Ozarks in the Missouri countryside—hill towns. And it was amazing how Warsaw became on the way to everything.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh [<em>laughs</em>]. Via Warsaw [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah. It didn’t matter where we were going.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>It was always by way of Warsaw…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Missouri. It could have been—it was Washing—Florida to Washington, D.C., is by way of Warsaw, Missouri. Uh…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] Oh, that’s good.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Seattle to Alabama for Squadron Officer School is by way of Warsaw, of course. That’s not too bad.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But, uh, everything was by way of Warsaw.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Wow[?]. That’s funny.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And then…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Does your wife like traveling?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Did she—yeah. She did.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, I [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>She’s now passed, but, uh, yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, I’m sorry.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>She did.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I didn’t know. Um…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, you’ve had a very interesting life.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah, ‘cause that particular—That first wife died about six years ago, but then she sent along a replacement, who ordered me up off of Match.com as her souvenir of her visit to America—the United States. And, uh, she’s Thai.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, really?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, how is your Thai? [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>My Thai is good enough…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible] mai tai [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>My Thai—Yeah. I can order one of those. Um…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Mai tai [inaudible] [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>My Thai is probably good enough to tell you “Hello” and “Goodbye.”</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>All of which is the same word: <em>sà-wàt-dee</em>. And to ask, “<em>Hông náam yòo têe năi?</em>” “Where’s the toilet?” in Thai.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] Good one[?]. Good phrase [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And I could say thank you: <em>kòp kun mâak</em>. And that’s about it. Uh, fortunately…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible] If you were in procurement, people must have been saying, “Thank you” to you often.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, they were.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Okay[?]. Were you bribed at any time? Or tempted to be bribed?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No. No. Though, uh, some people had trouble with the U.S. standards on that. And in one particular instance in Thailand, uh, the contractors just could not understand when we said, “No. We cannot take anything.” So one Thanksgiving or Christmas or something, they showed up with a lot of turkeys and stuff. “No. we cannot take it.” “But I can’t take it.” “Well, okay.” we gave it to the orphanage.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, that was a good idea.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But no.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>You must have come across a lot of interesting situations like that. That’s a—that’s…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>We came across a lot of things that were cultural differences.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes, but I mean in the actual process of what you were doing. First of all, you had to find out who to start with to ask for what you needed. And then you had to choose between them.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>You had to choose between—yes. You have to define what you need. You have to find the people that can fill your need. And then you have to make a choice as to which one is going to fill it, and you have to pay attention to a whole long list of social things, as to which person can have this particular contract. Um…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>So you had to do a lot of hard work?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah. Yeah. Well, this is all goes with part of the job.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>The job. Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Government procurement and commercial are not the same.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And the big difference is the rules that, uh, the government person has to follow. And people that[sic] I was—when I was teaching at OSI, one of their frequently raised complaints was: “Well, it would be so much cheaper if we did this, or if we did it that way.” And I would have to explain to them that the, um, military procurement regulations, which fill a space like this, were not designed for the efficient and economic acquisition of goods and services for the military. They were designed to fill the social aims of Congress first. And after you fill the social aims of Congress, then we do things to make sure we get stuff.</p>
<p>But we have things like—you have Buy American Act [of 1933]. You have a, um, law that governs the amount of money that must be paid to the contractors on the job, which often is very different than the local prevailing wages. You have to procure from minority-owned businesses. You want to procure from women- owned businesses.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>They did that then? Back that far?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, yeah. They’ve done this for a long time. And it goes on and on and on. On certain type of business would be set aside, to be filled by only people who meet these social constraints. Whatever they were.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>To fill the social aims of Congress. Um, I [inaudible]…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Tell me what was your biggest disappointment during this time?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Uh…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Something…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>I can’t think of one at the moment.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Go wrong after you went half way into it, or something like that?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Pardon?</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Did anything go wrong after you went half way into it?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>No. The only interesting thing was I never intended to stay there.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>I intended to do my first tour of duty, and then get out.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But by the time that, uh, point came up, Air Force requirement is four years of service after commissioning. And the point I had four years of service, and I had three little children. And I knew I needed a Master’s Degree, and there wasn’t any way that I was going to be able to support four little children and a wife and go get a Master’s Degree on my own. And the Air Force says, “We will send you to, uh, George Washington University for your MBA [Master’s of Business Administration], if you would like. All you have to accept is an extended service commitment of three times the length of that year and a half of school.” And then every time I did that, or I got promoted, or I got sent somewhere, there was always a service commitment attached to it. It wasn’t until I had 18 years of service in, that I could’ve get out if I wanted to. At that point, I stopped accepting any offers for anything that had a commitment on it.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I see. That’s understandable. And I think you [inaudible]…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>But by then, I was at Rock Island Arsenal in Illinois.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>I think—I think you’ve your judgments in order.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Hm.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Because I—I admire what you put first[?].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>But you certainly had an intering—interesting career.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Tell me about something that—funny that happened whence you—when—when you were in one of these places.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Well, alright. Well, uh, the one we were talking about at lunchtime. Military people on active duty, and as a retiree, are entitled to fly space available on military aircraft from one point to another. ‘Course you have last priority.</p>
<p>So we were in Japan, and my wife wanted to go to [South] Korea, which there were frequent flights between Yokota Air Base in Japan and Osan Air Base in Korea. So we went over to Korea, and on the way over we rode on a chartered airliner. And this just like riding in any other airliner, except this one is under charter with the [U.S.] DOD [Department of Defense].</p>
<p>And we went shopping in Seoul[, Gyeonggi-do, South Korea]. She bought all kinds of stuff. We got back down to Osan Air Base with the—almost a pick-up truck full of, um, things that she wanted to take, and found out there was no space available going back to Japan. There were lots of people like us and no space going back. And furthermore, there were no hotel rooms available in this little town outside Osan to spend the night.</p>
<p>So I called up my friend, who was the OSI boss in Osan, because this was shortly after my—my OSI tour, so I still knew the people. And he called around, and he called me back, and says, “Okay. Go down to this hotel,” [<em>clears throat</em>] “and they’ll take care of you and put you up for the night.” We did. And the next morning, I informed her that she had just spent the night in a whorehouse.</p>
<p><strong>All<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And how…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>That’s what it was.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And how did you get back? [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So we went back to the base to wait along with all of these other people, and the, uh, wing at Yokota sent a training flight over to Osan. The Air Force flies training flights all the time. They have to. To train the people. Keep their skills up. So they said, “Okay. Well, we got all these people waiting over there. We’ll send this flight over today to Osan to, uh—to pick these folks up.” And they did, in a [Lockheed] C-130 [Hercules]. The C-130 is a flying truck. You sit in the back end of this, and it’s like sitting in the back end of a big truck, on a canvas seat with very little in the way of heat or any sort of comforts whatsoever. So we all filed in there, put all of our luggage in there in front of us, and then…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>In front of you?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is a…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>All down the middle of the plane?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Down the middle. This is the bay of a cargo airplane. This is not an airliner.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>You—you’ve seen pictures though</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Now, they’re—they’re…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>In the movies.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>There—they’re about as—about like sitting in the back of a dump truck. Now, you load over the rear of that airplane. That’s how its tailgate goes down. And they can drive tanks, and trucks…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, I’ve seen</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And things like that. So everybody’s in there. We’re all sitting down, and the loadmaster goes to life the tailgate, and it won’t shut. Can’t get the door of the airplane shut.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>So he takes a piece of wire, wraps it around the door, holds it in place…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Take off to go back to Japan.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>All wired up [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And my brother-in-law, who is a—at that time, a paratrooper in the Army—uh, standard joke people ask him, “Why would you want to jump out of a perfectly good airplane?” And his answer is “Because the Air Force doesn’t have any.”</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>] Oh, really?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>This was…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Very interesting.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>A perfectly good airplane by Air Force standards. You could wire the door shut and fly.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Is there anything else you would like to tell us before we end?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Oh, I guess that’s probably about it.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Well, you’ve been an easy person, because I was supposed to tell you at the beginning, that this is for you to tell your stories, and I’m just…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Okay[?].</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Just there to ask the questions. But it was, uh—I didn’t have to do that, because you had so many stories, and you told them so well, and it was really interesting, and I’m sure everyone who reads veterans’ stories will like this story.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>If we’ve got time for one more quick[sic] one…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes. We do.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>This is a funny one—to me, a funny one. Seattle is bordered on the eastern side of the city by a 20-mile long fresh water lake called Lake Washington. And One particular day, one of my friends up[?] there and I decided to check out some sailboats, because we had a—a sailboat, rather—as the Navy base had sailboats, and do sailing on Lake Washington. And we did. And we promptly knocked the sailboat down.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>And we got it back up, and then we promptly knocked it down again. Now, the big lesson that I learned about doing that was that a can of beer, if it has not been opened, will float.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Because the beer we had, we can’t—that hadn’t been opened yet—all of it just floated every time we knocked the sailboat over, and so we got it back up, and we got out beer back on board.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Oh, really? That’s interesting. Is it because there’s air in the can?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Sure.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Or because there’s not very much in it? [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>There’s air in the can, and a can of beer is sealed. It can’t get out, and it floats. And I…</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>[inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Didn’t know until then that a can of beer will float.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Is there anything else you’d like to tell us…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /> </strong>No.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>We conclude?</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Now that I’m thinking about it, I could go all afternoon.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Yes[?]. Well, you were the easiest person to interview, I must say. Um, let’s see there was something I wanted to say to you, as well. Well, we—we thank you very much for being part of this program,</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Sure.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>And, um, I certainly enjoyed listening to your story, so I think you’ll be a great contributor. And…</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>I hope so.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>So thank you very much.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>You’re welcome.</p>
<p><strong>Scherer<br /></strong>Good luck.</p>
<p><strong>McGuire<br /></strong>Thank you.</p>
<div><br /><div>
<p><a title="">[1]</a> Correction: Yokota Air Base.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[2]</a> Officially the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church).</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[3]</a> September 17, 1945-January 31, 1946.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[4]</a> Also known as the Republic of the Union of Myanmar.</p>
</div>
</div>
2nd Lieutenant
African Enterprise
AFROTC
Air Force
Air Force Reserve Officers' Training Corps
aircraft
airplanes
Ambassador
AMC
ammunition procurement division
Armed Forces Staff College
Army Materiel Command
Army Military Intelligence Readiness Command
BAA
baht
Bangkok, Thailand
bargains
Baton Rouge, Louisiana
bribery
bribes
business administration
Buy American Act of 1933
C-130
cargo
Chokchai Building
Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter-Day Saints
CID
comfort girls
Community Veterans History Project
Congress
conscription
construction
consultants
contract administrators
contracting
contractors
corruption
Criminal Investigator's Department
CVHP
DCAS
declaration of war
Defense Contract Administration Services
deputy directors
DOD
Downtown Bangkok
drafts
Durban, South Africa
engineering
engineers
Fawley, England
Fussa, Japan
George C. McGuire
George Washington University
GWU
hospitals
Judy Scherer
Korea
Lake Washington
LDS Church
legislation
lieutenant colonel
Lockheed C-130 Hercules
McCoy AFB
McCoy Air Force Base
Ministry of Defense
MIRC
Missouri
Mom Rajawongse Seni Pramoj
Mormonism
Mormons
NAS Sand Point
Naval Air Station Sand Point
New Jersey
New York City, New York
New York Harbor
Norfolk, Virginia
Notre Dame, Indiana
OIA
oil
oil refineries
oil refinery
orlando
Orlando AFB
Orlando Air Force Base
Orlando International Airport
Osan AB
Osan Air Base
OSI
planes
President of Thailand
presidents
procurement centers
procurement officers
prostitutes
prostitution
Pyeongtaek-si,South Korea
regulations
Reserve Officers' Training Corps
retirement
Rock Island Arsenal
Rose Marie Scherer
ROTC
sailboats
sailing
scandals
Seattle, Washington
Second Lieutenant
Seni Pramoj
Seni Pramoj, Mom Rajawongse
Seoul, South Korea
sex workers
Single Manager for Conventional Ammunition
Squadron Officer School
Statue of Liberty
Summit, New Jersey
Thai
Thai Ministry of Defense
Thailand
tour of duty
U.S. Air Force
U.S. Air Force Office of Special Investigations
U.S. ambassador
U.S. Army
U.S. Army Materiel Command
U.S. Army Military Intelligence Readiness Command
U.S. Department of Defense
U.S. Navy
UND
University of Notre Dame
University of Notre Dame du La
USAF
USAFOSI
veterans
Vietnam
Vietnam War
Warsaw, Missouri
Washington, D.C.
Whiteman AFB
Whiteman Air Force Base
World War II
WWII
Yokota AB
Yokota Air Base
-
https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/cf54e641fa0d4b54defe352f173e3897.pdf
c11b2eb95128c7178d7e692f93672926
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
World War II Collection
Alternative Title
WWII Collection
Subject
World War II, 1939-1945
Veterans--Florida
Is Part Of
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/24" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection</a>, RICHES of Central Florida.
Language
eng
Type
Collection
Contributing Project
<a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a><span>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida</span>
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
Description
Although Japan and China were already engaged war since 1937, September 1, 1939 is generally considered the beginning date of World War II. It was on this day that Adolf Hitler (1889-1945), the Führer of Nazi Germany, invaded Poland, inciting France and the United Kingdom to declare war. Through the course of the war, belligerents were general divided into two groups: the Allied Powers, consisting of the United Kingdom, France, the Soviet Union, China, Poland, Canada, Australia, India, Yugoslavia, Greece, the Netherlands, Belgium, South Africa, New Zealand, Norway, Czechoslovakia, Ethiopia, Brazil, Denmark, Luxembourg, Cuba, Mexico, the Philippines, Mongolia, and Iran; and the Axis Powers, consisting of Germany, Japan, Italy, Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria.
The United States did not join the Allies until the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor on December 7, 1941. War was waged for several years. On May 8, 1945, Germany surrendered to Soviet and Polish troops in response to the capture of Berlin just a few days earlier, in effect ending the war in Europe. The war in the Pacific theater did not end until Japan surrendered on August 15, 1945, in response to the atomic attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
World War II transformed the globe's geopolitical context. The United Nations (UN) was established and the United States and Soviet Union emerged as opposing superpowers, setting the stage for the 46-year long Cold War. Much of Europe was left in economic collapse and decolonization began in Asia and Africa.
Contributor
<a href="http://library.ucf.edu/about/departments/special-collections-university-archives/" target="_blank">Special Collections and University Archives</a><span>, University of Central Florida Libraries, University of Central Florida</span>
Source Repository
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a><span>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida</span>
External Reference
<span>"</span><a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">About the Project</a><span>." UCF Community Veterans History Project, RICHES of Central Florida, University of Central Florida. http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/.</span>
Black, Jeremy. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/51306184" target="_blank"><em>World War Two: A Military History</em></a>. London: Routledge, 2003.
Maddox, Robert James. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/24066126" target="_blank"><em>The United States and World War II</em></a>. Boulder: Westview Press, 1992.
Davies, Norman, and Norman Davies. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/104891528" target="_blank"><em>No Simple Victory: World War II in Europe, 1939-1945</em></a>. New York: Viking, 2007
Zeiler, Thomas W. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/51905775" target="_blank"><em>Unconditional Defeat: Japan, America, and the End of World War II</em></a>. Wilmington, Del: Scholarly Resources, 2004.
Ferguson, Niall. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/70839824" target="_blank"><em>The War of the World: Twentieth-Century Conflict and the Descent of the West</em></a>. New York: Penguin Press, 2006.
Reynolds, David. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/646790595" target="_blank"><em>From World War to Cold War Churchill, Roosevelt, and the International History of the 1940s</em></a>. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2006.
Coverage
Naval Training Center, Orlando, Florida
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Oral History of Frank V. Boffi
Alternative Title
Oral History, Boffi
Subject
Veterans--Florida
World War II
Description
An oral history interview of Frank V. Boffi (b. 1922), who served in the U.S. Navy from 1942 to 1945 and again from 1948 to 1952. Boffi was born in Cranston, Rhode Island, on May 18, 1922. He served during both World War II and the Korean War, and was stationed on USS <em>Bernadou</em>, USS <em>Hugh W. Hadley</em>, USS <em>Brownson</em>n, and USS <em>Fiske</em>. Boffi also took part in the Allied Invasion of Sicily, the Battle of Anzio, and the Battle of Okinawa. He received a Purple Heart, among other awards, and achieved the rank of 1st Class Machinist. This interview was conducted by Luis Santana Garcia at the University of Central Florida in Orlando, Florida. Topics discussed in the oral history include Boffi's background, his enlistment, fighting in Italy, the construction of the USS <em>Hugh W. Hadley</em> and its subsequent destruction, serving in the Pacific Theater, leaving the Navy, his medals and citations, and the Lone Sailor Memorial Project.
Table Of Contents
0:00:00 Introduction<br />0:00:30 Background and family<br />0:02:00 Entry into service<br />0:08:30 First days of service<br />0:12:37 Invading Italy as an American of Italian heritage<br />0:14:30 Experience during the battles in Italy<br />0:19:30 USS <em>Hugh W. Hadley</em> construction, training, and the Pacific Theater<br />0:23:23 Typical day and recreational activities<br />0:25:30 Life after service<br />0:27:50 Medals, citations, and values learned<br />0:29:42 VIDEO SKIPS<br />0:30:00 Future of the Lone Sailor Memorial Project<br />0:31:43 Closing remarks
Abstract
Oral history interview of Frank V. Boffi. Interview conducted by Luis Santana Garcia.
Type
Moving Image
Source
Boffi, Frank V. Interviewed by Luis Santana Garcia. Audio/video record available. <a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/ref/collection/VET/id/267" target="_blank">Item DP0014888</a>, <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
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<a href="http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/" target="_blank"> Adobe Flash Player</a>
<a href="http://java.com/en/download/index.jsp" target="_blank"> Java</a>
Is Part Of
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/95" target="_blank">World War II Collection</a>, UCF Community Veterans History Project Collection, RICHES of Central Florida.
Has Format
Boffi, Frank V. Interviewed by Luis Santana Garcia. Audio/video record available. <a href="http://digitalcollections.net.ucf.edu/cdm/ref/collection/VET/id/267" target="_blank">Item DP0014888</a>, <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
Digital transcript of original 32-minute and 25-second oral history: Boffi, Frank V. Interviewed by Luis Santana Garcia. Audio/video record available. <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, Orlando, Florida.
Conforms To
Standards established by the <a href="http://www.loc.gov/vets/" target="_blank">Veterans History Projects</a>, Library of Congress.
Coverage
Cranston, Rhode Island
Downtown Providence, Rhode Island
Newport, Rhode Island
Boston, Massachusetts
Naval Training Center, Orlando, Florida
Sicily, Salerno, Italy
Anzio Beach, Italy
Oran, Algeria
Tinian, Northern Mariana Islands
Okinawa, Japan
Vatican Necropolis, Vatican, Vatican City
Creator
Boffi, Frank V.
Garcia, Luis Santana
Publisher
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Contributor
Barnes, Mark
Date Created
2014-02-26
Date Copyrighted
2014-02-26
Format
application/website
application/pdf
Extent
12.1 MB
188 KB
Medium
32-minute and 25-second Hi8 CD/DVD
15-page digital transcript
Language
eng
Mediator
History Teacher
Civics/Government Teacher
Geography Teacher
Provenance
Originally created by Luis Santana Garcia and Frank V. Boffi and published by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>.
Rights Holder
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
Accrual Method
Item Creation
Contributing Project
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/veterans/" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="http://digital.library.ucf.edu/cdm/landingpage/collection/VET" target="_blank">UCF Community Veterans History Project</a>, UCF Digital Collections, University of Central Florida
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
Source Repository
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES of Central Florida</a>
External Reference
Black, Jeremy. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/51306184" target="_blank"><em>World War Two: A Military History</em></a>. London: Routledge, 2003.
Maddox, Robert James. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/24066126" target="_blank"><em>The United States and World War II</em></a>. Boulder: Westview Press, 1992.
Davies, Norman, and Norman Davies. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/104891528" target="_blank"><em>No Simple Victory: World War II in Europe, 1939-1945</em></a>. New York: Viking, 2007.
Zeiler, Thomas W. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/51905775" target="_blank"><em>Unconditional Defeat: Japan, America, and the End of World War II</em></a>. Wilmington, Del: Scholarly Resources, 2004.
Ferguson, Niall. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/70839824" target="_blank"><em>The War of the World: Twentieth-Century Conflict and the Descent of the West</em></a>. New York: Penguin Press, 2006.
Reynolds, David. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/646790595" target="_blank"><em>From World War to Cold War Churchill, Roosevelt, and the International History of the 1940s</em></a>. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2006.
Click to View (Movie, Podcast, or Website)
<a href="http://stars.library.ucf.edu/veteransoralhistories/214/" target="_blank">Boffi, Frank V.</a>
Transcript
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Today is February 26<sup>th</sup>, 2014. I am interviewing Frank Boffi, who served in the United States Navy. He served in World War II and ended with a rank of Machinist MAT 1<sup>st</sup> class. With me is Mark...</p>
<p><strong>Barnes<br /></strong>Mark Barnes.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Mark Barnes. We are interviewing Mr. Boffi as part of the University of Central Florida Community Veterans History Project and as research for the creation of a Lone Sailor Memorial Project. We are recording this interview at UCF in Orlando, Florida. Mr. Boffi, will you please start by—start us off by telling us when and where you were born?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Cranston, Rhode Island, which is about nine miles north of, uh Downtown Providence[, Rhode Island]. I was born May 18<sup>th</sup>, 1922, and I’m the, uh, youngest of seven boys. We were a family of 10 children. Raised during the Great Depression which is—was hell on life—on Earth, really. So we had to get adjusted to that— not having anything.</p>
<p>I’ve been lecturing five high schools here locally about World War II and the kids don’t believe that, during the Depression, we had no allowance, we had nothing, and, uh—but anyway, I survived the Depression. I survived three battles in the Pacif—the, uh, Mediterranean [Sea], and the one battle in the Pacific [Theater]. So I consider myself a survivor.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What did your parents do for a living?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>They were, uh, country folks. My dad worked—was a laborer, because in Italy they lived out on farms, and came over here had really no skills. and, um, he worked for—under the WPA systems, which was the Works Progress Administration—back in the [19]30s, uh, one of the programs set by President [Franklin Delano] Roosevelt. So he was just a, uh, shovel—a reg[?] guy. He was working on the roads and the parks and stuff that the city was rocking[?] for him. That sort of thing.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And when did you, uh, enter the Navy?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>I, uh, entered—first of all, I think it’s important to hear that we<a title="">[1]</a> got engaged December 6<sup>th</sup>, 1941, which was the night before the Pearl Harbor attack. And, um, it’s so strange: these high schools that I’ve been lecturing—that’s the one thing those kids remember when I go back the next year after that. Yeah. I ask what they remember about World War II and they all say the same thing, “You and your wife got engaged the night before Pearl Harbor.”</p>
<p>We got—I got married at, uh, 20 years old—August 1<sup>st</sup>, 1942. And on September 15<sup>th</sup>, 1942, I went down and enlisted in the Navy, because I did not want to be drafted into the Army. I was told that the Navy, you had three square a day and clean bedding, as long as you washed it. But the Army guys had to sleep in mud and foxholes and I didn’t want that kind of stuff.</p>
<p>But, um, yeah. We were—I—my wife and I were married 71 years this past August 1<sup>st</sup>, and then she died October 7<sup>th</sup>, [inaudible] 2014. But, uh, it was a tough life, but we hacked it through[?]. It was just two young kids. She was 22 and I was 20, but we made it and it was a real sacrifice. We only had the one son who has—now has two children and six great, uh—six grandchildren. I have six great-grandchildren.</p>
<p>My son is a graduate of the University of Nebraska, where he has a master’s [degree] out of the university. Um, He started in engineering, but he changed it over to psychology. And I asked him why he changed his major[?] over the subject—his degree in, and he said one of his friends dove out of the six—I think he said it was a six-story window. And He was on LSD [lysergic acid diethylamide] and he just dove out the window. And that was when my son decided to change his career and help the kids that were—that were on drugs. He was—he wound up being an administrator of six counties in east Nebraska—in charge of the drug program. But Now he’s a—he was a regional manager for Xerox [Corporation], and they moved him to Washington, D.C. area. And now he’s, uh—has his own business—he and his wife—as general resources. Um, he’s chief operating officer for AmeriCom. It’s a company that deals with the government, and their biggest account is the Air Force. And he is in, uh, San Antonio[, Texas] about every four or five weeks, because we have bases there. What else you want?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Now, uh, you said you were—got engaged the day before Pearl Harbor. What was your reaction to the attack on Pearl Harbor?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>It was kind of a shock, but We, uh, I think we were prepared for it. The—the way things were going, we knew that some war was going to come out of it. It was so strange: in Downtown Providence—I’m not sure if you’re familiar with it—they had docks there. And, uh, my buddy and I—we used to go down there. we used to walk to Providence maybe two days a week, and there were all these old rust buckets loading up with all the, um, scrap iron, and we sold millions and millions of tons of scrap iron to Japan. And then—then four or five months, the war broke out, they were firing it right back at us.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Why did you join the Navy?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Like I told you, I didn’t like—I didn’t like being in a foxhole, and I didn’t want to join the Army. I had one brother in the Army and two—the one in the Navy, he joined long after I did. But, uh, my other two brothers were [Boeing] B17 [Flying Fortress] bombers.</p>
<p>And, uh, I—I just liked the water. I thought I would be better off in the Navy. Might as well do something I like, than[?] rather[?]—I had to go no matter what. I didn’t want to be drafted in the Army.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Where did you attend boot camp?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi <br /> </strong>I, uh, went to boot camp in Newport, Rhode Island. I reported there October 15<sup>th</sup>, 1942 and got in out March 1943. And they sent me to [inaudible] Institute in Boston[, Massachusetts], which is an engineering school. And I came out of there with a, uh—with a second class machinist MAT training.</p>
<p>It was so strange that, in those days, uh—that—that the commander of the school posted a notice one day saying anybody in the top five percentile for academics would be allowed the privilege of applying for Officer’s[sic] Candidate School. So I applied for it, and that’s all it says. And I walked up, and commander Cavinar[sp] was sitting at his desk, and I came in the door about that distance away, and he kind of looked up and says, “Frank, you don’t qualify.” I said, “But I’m in the top three percentile academically.” He said, “Yeah. Academically you can qualify, but you’re married.” They would not give you a rate[?] then—a commission [inaudible]. You had to be married first though—no. You—you couldn’t get married until after you got your commission. that’s what it was. So they refused to give me a commission.</p>
<p>And, uh, then later on when I worked[?] the ship got sunk, I was supposed to make chief June 1<sup>st</sup>, 1945. And we got sunk on the 11<sup>th</sup> of May of 1945. That’s when I wound up in a hospital bed for the next four and a half months. So they wouldn’t give me the chief’s rating, because you had to be with an active unit.</p>
<p>Now, today even, if you lost both legs, you’re still in the military, you get your rating or whatever. So, um, when they held its 90<sup>th</sup> birthday, the chiefs down here at NAWC [Naval Air Warfare Center] made me an honorary, um, chief with them. So I have a [U.S.] DOD [Department of Defense] certificate stating that I’m part of the chiefs’ at NAWCTSD in Orlando. They—they kind of glorified it and they gave me the rate. I asked them about it—OCS [Officer Candidate School] now, but they wouldn’t allow me [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What was, uh, your first days of your service like?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Pardon?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What was the first day of your service like? First days.</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, the—the first couple of days were interesting, because we had some boys from the Midwest area[?] they were Arkansans. We had to sleep on hammocks. In those days, in boot camp. And the hammock was strung up to the ceiling and you had what you called the” jack stand.” That’s a bar, and you would jump up and grab it and you’d pull your body up. And if you knew how to do it, you would open your hammock line with one leg and then pop your butt in and then—otherwise, you would just roll off the other side. and that’s what was happening to this one boy from Arkansas. He couldn’t—he’d get in one side and roll out the other one. He couldn’t get himself—so one night, the chief told a couple of us to “Go help that kid get in that hammock.” And, Uh, We raised the sides up, but in the morning he tried to get out and he’d fall out all the time. He was a character. He never did adjust to a hammock. We kept our hammocks as part of our sea bag. And I’ve used it two or three times at sea out here in the Atlantic [Ocean]. When we had a hurricane or real bad weather, the ship would go rocking and rolling too much. My buddy and I would go out and string up our hammock underneath the gun tug, where it would be dry, and sleep in the hammocks. We just—like a baby rocking in a crib.</p>
<p>But, um, yeah. The first ship was on was a 1918—it was commissioned in 1918—a World War I destroyer. It was an old four stacker, and we called them “rust buckets.” But Then [<em>clears throat</em>]—and we made the three invasions of, um, [inaudible] Sicily, Salerno, Italy, and, um—what was the last one? One of the—one—I forget the name of that one. Oh, [inaudible]. My memory is failing me, but we made the two—three invasions in Sa—Sicily, Anzio Beach, Salerno—Anzio Beach. That’s what it is. Anzio Beach, Salerno, and, um, you know, Sicily.</p>
<p>We operated out of Oran[, Algeria], North Africa. That was kind of a[sic], uh, interesting—now that we have so much Muslim, uh, religion spreading out all over the world. There was a place in Oran that was called Medina. It was a, uh, sacred city with great big columns and you were not allowed in there unless you were a, um, Muslim religion[sic]. And my buddy and I didn’t believe it, so we started in there one day, and we get about three feet through the gates, all these Arabs started getting up from sitting on the sidewalk. And, um, we were lucky. I think I—I’m alive today, because the shore patrol was right there. They drive their Jeep in about three feet into the Medina, and told us to get in and they brought us back [inaudible].</p>
<p>And they told us that one of my friends, uh, Bill Suey[sp], came from Cranston, Rhode Island—.he and I went through school together. He went through Medina one night and came back in just his underwear—just his skivvies. He was lucky he got his life, but they took everything he had—his uniform, cigarettes, and—and they stripped him. They didn’t want us there. Basically, that’s what it was. We were invading their country and—and they—they didn’t realize that we were there protecting them from the Germans. I mean, they were losing their country to the Germans till we got there. And, um, so we saved them, but they’re still Muslim and that scares me till today—what’s happening in some of these cities. [<em>clears throat</em>] It’s a damn shame that we have to go through stuff, but I see it happening right now.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Now, uh, as an Italian [American], how did it feel invading Italy?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>How did I feel being in Italy?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Yeah.</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>It was, uh, a good feeling. Because I was—my mom and my eldest brother came over in 1904. And this was 19—well, I didn’t get there until during the war, but I stayed in the Navy and I went back in 1950 with the ship I was on. And I got to meet my, uh, dad’s two brothers, and my cousins, and my mom’s half-sister.</p>
<p>And her—this one half-sister has three—three daughters. And they came to my uncle’s house and the eldest—eldest daughter was, um, just—just under 18. She was a senior in—in high school—equivalent to our schedule setup. And, um, she was so excited that I was talking to an Italian in English and all that. And she kept patting my knee, and the moms kept telling them, “Don’t touch him. he’s an American sailor.” She said, “But he’s my cousin.” She said, “I don’t care if he’s your brother. Don’t lo—don’t touch him. He’s an American sailor.” But that was the kind of reputation we had all over the world. The—the sailors were people [<em>coughs</em>] [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p>And I had one other cousin, who had a close friend of his who was a [Papal] Swiss Guard in the Vatican. So I got to, uh, go places in the Vatican that the general public had never been to. And we got way down deep into the catacombs,<a title="">[2]</a> where they used to bury all the priests and the bishops and whatever. There—it was kind of an eerie feeling being down there with all these caskets on both sides. And these guys didn’t realize that they’ve been buried there for a hundred years or longer. That was something that the general public never saw, but I got to see it because of my cousin’s—Tom’s—friend was a Swiss Guard. He allowed me to go down there [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Now what—what was…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>[<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What your experience during the actual battles?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>What was what?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What your experience during the actual battles themselves?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, um, uh, the, uh—at the Anzio Beach location, I was on deck and that was a, uh, a 50 millimeter—50 caliber machine gun. And that really was the only action I’ve ever—I’ve ever seen. Because, um, normally, I would be engine room. You would not see any action. And, uh, It’s so strange that now I—you know, there were three destroyers in our squadron. We were all—we were all World War I destroyers. And they, uh, used us as decoys. The American government had no, um, um, information as to where the gun emplacements were. So they—the three destroyers were supposed to go in, approach the beach with all their lights out [inaudible]. And at midnight, put on our search light. We had a great big, regular search light they use at airports. And, uh, there was total darkness. I couldn’t see you guys as dark as it was. And all of a sudden, at midnight, when we put our search lights on, all hell—the beach just broke all out, and I jumped.</p>
<p>And I found out later that that was a trigger, because I was subject to that for a long, long time. I mean, if we walked—if I walked in this room and someone tried to put the—somebody put the light on, I would react to it. And Now I—I found out that eventually, training with the VA [Veterans Administration] and, um—my son, um, met the woman who was the CO of the Purple Heart Association.<a title="">[3]</a> And she sent me a book, and then I read that—<em>Tears of a Warrior</em>[<em>: A Family's Story of Combat and Living with PTSD</em>] it’s called. I found out that that was only a “trigger,” that they called them. And so I finally got myself to overcome that, and it doesn’t bother me anymore now, but Going into this totally dark room and somebody put the light on. But—and I do it every night when I go home. It’s be totally dark in the house and I flip my own light on, but I don’t react to it anymore like I used to. ‘Cause I suddenly realized that it was just something that was back here and I had to weed it out of my system.</p>
<p>But, uh, normally, I saw no action on my—the—on the [USS <em>Hugh W.</em>] <em>Hadley</em>. I didn’t see any action, until we got, uh, blown out of the engine room—came topside. And to this day, I don’t remember seeing any action then. And I found out from Captain [Doug] Aiken, who’s retired—he was a lieutenant on the <em>Hadley</em>. I asked him how long we were—were in the water, and he said about two and a half hours before we were picked up. And I’ve got—if you want me to email you, I’ve got the picture of that, uh—the ship picking up the survivors and I’ve got the DVD that I can send you and incorporate it with part[?] of yours. It shows a Kamikaze hitting the water and showed the—the bomb going off—something like that. I can get you a copy of those if you—if you wish. They’re not copyrighted at all, so you’re welcome to do with it what—whatever you want with ‘em [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And so you—you said you were—you were sent in as a decoy. Once—once, like, you complete your mission, did they figure out where the emplacements were and then did you guys leave after that?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, we didn’t really leave the battle area. We went out on, uh, screening. They called it “screening.” You had two or three destroyers. Well, that day, there were like 15 destroyers out there. And just—you stayed off the beach about three or four miles and tried to shoot down the planes that were coming in to attack our troops. And they were coming in to hit our supply ships [inaudible]. So we were on—on the screening most of the time, at the—Of course, I wasn’t there, but the ship was. I was in the hospital. That was—let’s see—May, June—two and a half months in the, uh, ten city hospital. We called it “ten city” in Tinian Island, which is part of the Marianas.<a title="">[4]</a></p>
<p>And, uh, In July of ’45, they sent me to a naval receiving hospital in San Francisco, California. stayed there a couple of weeks, and from there, they sent me to a psychiatric hospital up in Coeur d’Alene, Idaho, because I was getting a severe—I mean, real bad headaches. It was the back of my head and they thought I was going crazy, I guess. It was just blast concussion. It finally settled down. And after about six—I think six or eight weeks in Coeur d’Alene, I was transferred on down to Sun Valley, Idaho, in which there was a naval recuperation hospital. And then, in October of ’45, they transferred me to Fort Lewis, Washington. And, um, from there, to Boston to be discharged in November of 1945 [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Alright. And, um,what—when, uh—you said that you were on, um—what was the name of the first ship you were on?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>The USS <em>Bernadou</em>, B-E-R-N-A-D-O-U.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And, um, how did you, like—and then you transferred to the <em>Hadley</em>?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>No. They sent me to school for—the <em>Hadley</em> was so called “new construction.” It was a, uh, bigger class destroyer, and it was higher pressure. We operated at 600 pounds of pressure steam on the <em>Hadley</em>, and the <em>Bernadou</em> was only 250. So I went to North Virginia to school for 12 weeks.</p>
<p>And then I went out to, um, San Pedro, California, and I was part of the 14 people that was the skeleton crew to watch the ship being built. That was quite interesting. And, you know, we saw them lay the keel hull in the dry dock. And we—we had to be in the dry dock every morning at eight o’ clock. That’s where they held quarters. And we literally watched the ship being built. Every—every bit of welding they did, we were there. There were 14 of us: one officer, and, uh, I think two chiefs, myself, another 1<sup>st</sup> class in engineering, and there, um—some other guys from other rates I don’t know—the yeoman[?] and [inaudible]. But, um—so I was on it when it went into the water in October of 1945—I mean ’44 — and we were sunk May of 1945. so it didn’t last very long.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>That was…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>[<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>That was during the Invasion of Okinawa[, Japan]?<a title="">[5]</a></p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Yes.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And what—what was your experience in that battle?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>My experience? Well, I didn’t see any action, because I was down in the engine room all the time.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>When you were in the engine room, what—like, what was your job, per se?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, to keep the ship moving. We had to keep the engines running, and, um— because if you lose your engines, then you are a dead, still target. Then they just blow you out of the water. So, uh—as a matter of fact, Marc [Ennis] is in simulation, and we had no simulators in those days. And I was—I had my pump man and my messenger blindfolded when they were on the lower level, where all the pumps are. And they had the second level was the operating deck—the control deck.</p>
<p>And I had them blindfolded, and the Chief Engineer comes down and he says, “Boffi, we don’t have any time for this blind man’s bluff games and stuff like that.” I said, “We’re not playing games, sir. I’m teaching these guys to know the engine room blindfolded.” That’s the first thing you lose on any situation is power. I mean, right now, if the power went off, we would be in a darkened room. So I said,” I’m trying teach them how to get out of there—this engine room.” And to this day, I think we all come[?]—[Don] Hackler, my master, was the last one to leave the engine room. We seemed to think he slipped down the ladder. he didn’t make it. Speedo, my bunkman, and myself got out. And that was the— Speedo got out first, and then I was second, and Hackler was—and he was only 17 years old. He had been in the Navy like 81 days. At the end of the war, they were taking real young kids in, with hardly any training at all. And, uh, Don Hackler—I think it was his name—and he was the only one that didn’t survive the—in that engine room. We lost, uh, everybody in the forward fire room, plus there were other people on deck. I think there were about 18 casualties that—fatalities that morning of the attack [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Uh,Going back a little bit, what—what was…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>[<em>coughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Saily life like on the Navy vessel?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>A normal day?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Mmhmm.</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Normally, you get up at about five—normally, you get up about 5:30 for regular crew. But in engineering, you’re—you’re on four hours and off eight. So we would be getting up at like 3:15 in the morning for the four to eight watch. And, uh, for the midnight watch, you got on—you had to be up by quarter to 12, and that ran to—to quarter to four, and that ran to quarter to eight. And, um, once you got in the engine room though, there was no—I didn’t do much. I just sat there, che—checked the other guys, and did some checking of equipment, and stuff like that. But—mostly management. I didn’t really do anything. There was nothing you could do. Just be ready to—if you did take a hit, be ready, you know, do—to you could react. Do what you had to do.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And you told us about…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>[<em>coughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Some of the, uh, recreational things you did while you were in Italy and Africa. Were there anything in the Pacific—any areas In the Pacific that you got to experience in the Pacific?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>No. I never got off the ship. We never had any liberty and such. So I know noth—nothing about the Pacific Ocean, other—other than being aboard a ship. We did hit Pearl Harbor[, Hawaii] before—on the way up there—that area. We had about three days in Pearl Harbor. and that was my only experience in Hawaii for a long time. But, uh, you know, you pull into a Navy base and you really have nothing to do. most of them are kind of isolated away from the normal public. We didn’t have the, uh—the glory of—the liberty, so to speak. We got four hours off. Didn’t have enough time to run into town, grab a couple of beers, hopefully get lucky and get a woman, and back to the ship [<em>laughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>[<em>laughs</em>]. And, um…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>[<em>coughs</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What—What was it like when you left the Navy—like, coming home?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, I—I went to work for the power company. I—I wanted to—see, I used to work in jewelry—jewelry manufacturing, when I was in high school. After I got out of high school, and I told my wife—said, “I’m—I’m going to go into something that was going to be a career, like…” So I—I went to the power company, and after I got into trouble with that union, they run me off.</p>
<p>So I got an insurance job as an engineer. And I inspected elevators and boilers, held safety meetings. Then I, um—April 1<sup>st</sup>, 1970, when the OSHA [Occupational Safety and Health Act] law came into being, it was signed by the President<a title="">[6]</a> as the—a law of the land. And I went to, uh, what is now the University of Southern Florida<a title="">[7]</a> and took a two day exam—two eight hour exams—for, uh, my—they call it Certi—CSP—Certified Safety Professional. And, um, I passed that, so they gave me the designation. That’s what I was when I retired—a Certified Safety Professional.</p>
<p>When I was, uh, working for the insurance company, I—I did the service for a lot of power utilities and inspected elevators in a lot of buildings. My territory included Puerto Rico, the [U.S.] Virgin Islands, and [the] Bahamas. It was a tough territory to—to take care of. And, Uh, Every other month, my wife would go with me and go on the beach, where we would get the hotel in San Juan[, Puerto Rico]. I’d go do my job, and then we would fly over to Saint Thomas[, U.S. Virgin Islands] and Saint Croix[, U.S. Virgin Islands]. I—I really enjoyed it. I—I—I did 50 years in the insurance industry. The, um—I retired March 1<sup>st</sup> of ’84, and then I re—they called me back. And then I retired again in—in 2001, I think it was. In 2006, they forced me to retire. They said I was too old at 84 years old to be inspecting boilers and elevators and all that kind of stuff, so I finally decided [inaudible].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And, Um, Were you awarded any medals or citations? [inaudible]…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>I have a Purple Heart for my injuries, and I’ve got, uh, three battle stars for the Mediterranean, three warzones, and three battles. And I’ve got, um, one battle for the, uh, Pacific. Other than that, uh, no high rating. Um, medals or anything.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Um,What values or characteristics of the Navy do you believe made an impression on—on your life?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>I think the camaraderie. There’s something about the Navy that the Army and the Marines never had. Uh, Like Mark, anybody would do anything for anyone else, if they were Navy. And I’m not sure that was true in the Army or the Marine Corps. My son became a Marine. He was in, uh, six years during the Vietnam [War] era. And, uh, I didn’t notice the camaraderie with them as I did in the Navy. And to this day, like I said, I go to NAWC every single day. They say I’m there more than people who get paid to be there. They don’t even show up and I’m there every morning.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And What was the most valuable lesson that you learned during your time?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>I’m sorry?</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>What was the most valuable lesson you learned during your time in the Navy?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Well, I think that you treat everybody that you would want to be treated, for one thing. The only thing that used to really bother me and still does to this day is these ethnic groups that come [inaudible]—the— immigrants—they come over here and they want us to change to be whatever they are, you know? The Hispanics or Chinese or—I mean, when you come over here, be an American. I can still hear my dad when I was a youngster, he kept saying this great…</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>And he, uh—to this day, I have arguments with some of these people. I am not an Italian. I’m of Italian heritage, but I was born in this country and I’m an American. I fought in several wars—battles—for the Americans. And I’d—I’d do it again if I had to, if that were necessary [<em>clears throat</em>].</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>And What do you think former Navy personnel would like to see or be reminded of when they visit—revisit the site of the base<a title="">[8]</a> and the Lone Sailor Project Memorial?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>What do I think of the—I think it’s going to bring back a lot of memories of a lot of people. I—I just—befriended—well, ,I’ve been friends with him for about a year and a half at the Moose Club. I didn’t know he was a photographer in the Army. And then, when he go out of the Army, he took all the photographs to the Navy base, where Mark graduated from, and he took all the shots over the Cape [Canaveral]. He went for the Cape. So, uh, that was kind of interesting.</p>
<p>He’s telling—he was telling Mark and myself about, um, incidents that had happened there before. And, uh, he’s going to be one of our guests at the next Navy League luncheon, I think. He can tell us some of the things that are interesting. Me[sic] and Mark were talking about those days.</p>
<p>I had no idea that there was a boot camp here. I lived up in, um, Miami since ’66, and never had an idea that there was a boot camp in Florida. So That was kind of a shock to me that I got up here and found out there was a boot camp there. I probably would have come up every weekend and go there and visit. I—I would have befriended—I would have taken the, uh, transfer—my company travels insurance wanted transferred me up here in, uh, ’69, I think it was. and I refused it. I wanted to stay around the Miami area, but, uh, if I would have known there was a boot camp up there in the Navy, um, influence, I think I would have—would have transferred.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Is there anything else you would like to share about your Navy experience?</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>It’s really helped me a lot, both psychologically and physically. I see they treat people here at NAWC. They really respect me. They show me a lot of respect. They all treat me as though I’m family. Officers, business people, and whatever. I’m just part of their big family and I enjoy it. That’s why I go every day.</p>
<p><strong>Garcia<br /></strong>Thank you, Mr. Boffi.</p>
<p><strong>Boffi<br /></strong>Thank you very much, and good luck in your ventures.</p>
<div><br /><div>
<p><a title="">[1]</a> Boffi and his wife.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[2]</a> Vatican Necropolis.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[3]</a> Correction: Purple Heart Foundation.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[4]</a> Northern Mariana Islands.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[5]</a> Battle of Okinawa, codenamed Operation Iceberg.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[6]</a> Richard Milhous Nixon.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[7]</a> Correction: University of South Florida.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><a title="">[8]</a> Naval Training Center (NTC) Orlando.</p>
</div>
</div>
Allied Invasion of Sicily
Anzio Beach, Italy
Arabs
Attack of Pearl Harbor
Battle of Anzio
Battle of Okinawa
battle stars
Bill Suey
boot camps
Boston, Massachusetts
camaraderie
catacombs
Cavinar
Certified Safety Professional
Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
construction
Cranston, Rhode Island
CSP
decoys
destroyers
Don Hackler
Doug Aiken
drafts
engineering
engineers
FDR
Fort Lewis
Frank V. Boffi
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Franklin Delano Rooosevelt
Frontline of Anzio and Nettuno
Great Depression
hammocks
health care
hospitals
immigrants
immigration
insurance
Islam
Italian Americans
Italian Campaign
Italy
jack stands
Kamikazes
Lone Sailor Memorial Project
Luis Santana Garcia
machinists
Marc Ennis
Mark Barnes
Mediterranean Seas
mental health
Moose Club
Muslims
Naval Air Warfare Center
Naval Air Warfare Center Training Systems Division
Naval Training Center Orlando
Navy League
NAWC
NAWCTSD
New Deal
Newport, Rhode Island
North Africa
NTC Orlando
Occupational Safety and Health Act
OCS
Officer Candidate School
Okinawa, Japan
Operation Husky
Operation Iceberg
Operation Shingle
Oran, Algeria
orlando
OSHA
Pacific Theater
Purple Heart Foundation
Purple Hearts
retirement
San Francisco, California
San Pedro, California
screening
skeleton crews
Speedo
Sun Valley, Idaho
Tears of a Warrior: A Family's Story of Combat and Living with PTSD
Tinian, Northern Mariana Islands
training
Trigger
U.S. Navy
UCF
UCF Community Veterans History Project
UCF CVHP
University of Central Florida
University of South Florida
USF
USS Bernadou
USS Brownson
USS Fiske
USS Hugh W. Hadley
VA
Vatican
Vatican City
Vatican Necropolis
veterans
Veterans Administration
wars
Works Progress Administration
World War II
WPA
WWII
-
https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka/files/original/4c6ae7fa34ef05a531f659e2cedfb366.jpg
fb923cfab8198aea672c2b997062f8a6
Omeka Image File
The metadata element set that was included in the `files_images` table in previous versions of Omeka. These elements are common to all image files.
Width
717
Height
1637
Bit Depth
8
Channels
3
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Sanford State Farmers' Market Collection
Description
The Sanford State Farmers' Market Collection contains images of the market's history and its significance to local and state agriculture. The Sanford State Farmers' Market was founded in 1934 in order to provide a central location in which farmers would sell their produce directly to consumers. The idea for the Sanford State Farmers' Market was devised by Fred Dorner and Gus Schmach, both members of the Seminole Agricultural Club. The Sanford Chamber of Commerce president Harry Papworth also contributed to the development of the market. The Federal Emergency Relief Administration (FERA) authorized construction plans on June 11, 1934. On June 20, 1934, the City of Sanford donated a portion of the Alex V. French properties to the Florida State Marketing Board, which selected the northwest corner of French Avenue and Thirteenth Street. The board approved the installation of telegraph and telephone equipment, as well as a three-pump filling station.
The Sanford State Farmer's Market opened on December 18, 1934. By 1939, the Farmers' Market was bringing a total volume of business of $627,065.81. In 1941, business volume reached over $700,000. On April 4, 1957, a fire destroyed the building and caused damages estimated at $2.5 million. Reconstruction began almost immediately and the Farmers' Market was expected to re-open by the fall of 1957. In 1991, plans were created to restore, preserve, and convert the citrus packing house into a museum.
Contributor
<a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a>
<a href="http://www.sanfordfl.gov/index.aspx?page=456" target="_blank">Sanford Museum</a>
<a href="http://dlis.dos.state.fl.us/" target="_blank">State Library and Archives of Florida</a>
Alternative Title
Sanford Farmers' Market Collection
Subject
Sanford (Fla.)
Farmers' markets--Florida
Agriculture--Florida
Farming
Is Part Of
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/16" target="_blank">Sanford Collection</a>, Seminole County Collection, RICHES of Cenral Florida.
Language
eng
Type
Collection
Coverage
Sanford State Farmers' Market, Sanford, Florida
Curator
Marra, Katherine
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/" target="_blank">RICHES MI</a>
External Reference
<span>Sheffield, Glenn. "<a href="http://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=52232" target="_blank">Sanford State Farmers' Market</a>." The Historical Marker Database. http://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=52232.</span>
Lewis, L. H. <a title="Florida State Farmers' Markets" href="http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00015016" target="_blank"><em>Florida State Farmers' Markets</em></a>. Tallahassee, Florida: State of Florida Department of Agriculture, 1955. http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00015016.
Florida. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/1403385" target="_blank"><em>Florida State Farmers Markets:...Annual Report</em></a>. Jacksonville, Fla: Board, 1945-, 1945.
<span>Sanford Historical Society (Fla.). <a title="Sanford" href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/53015288" target="_blank"><em>Sanford</em></a></span><span>. Charleston, SC: Arcadia, 2003.</span>
<span>"<a title="Sanford: a Brief History" href="http://www.sanfordfl.gov/index.aspx?page=48" target="_blank">Sanford: a Brief History</a>." City of Sanford Florida. http://www.sanfordfl.gov/index.aspx?page=48.</span>
<span>Bishop, Katherine. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/3576018" target="_blank"><em>Sanford Now and Then: An Official Project of the Greater Sanford Chamber of Commerce, Commemorating the Incorporating of the City of Sanford, 1877</em></a></span><span>. 1976.</span>
Document
A resource containing textual data. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre text.
Original Format
1 newspaper article
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
Farmers' Market Aide Retires
Alternative Title
Farmers' Market Aide Retires
Subject
Sanford (Fla.)
Buildings--Florida
Farmers' markets--Florida
Description
Newspaper article in the <em>The Sanford Herald</em> on the retirement of Edith Dutton in 1968, secretary to the manager of the Sanford State Farmers' Market, after 28 years of service.<br /><br /><span><span>The Sanford State Farmers' Market, at 1300 South French Avenue, was founded in 1934 in order to provide a central location in which farmers would sell their produce directly to consumers. The idea for the Sanford State Farmers' Market was devised by Fred Dorner and Gus Schmach, both members of the Seminole Agricultural Club. Sanford Chamber of Commerce president Harry Papworth also contributed to the development of the market. The Federal Emergency Relief Administration (FERA) authorized construction plans on June 11, 1934. On June 20, 1934, the City of Sanford donated a portion of the Alex V. French properties to the State Marketing Board, which selected the northwest corner of French Avenue and Thirteenth Street. The board approved the installation of telegraph and telephone equipment, as well as a three-pump filling station. The Sanford State Farmer's Market opened on December 18, 1934. By 1939, the Farmers' Market was bringing a total volume of business of $627,065.81. In 1941, business volume reached over $700,000. On April 4, 1957, a fire destroyed the building and caused damages estimated at $2.5 million. Reconstruction began almost immediately and the Farmers' Market was expected to re-open by the fall of 1957. In 1991, plans were created to restore, preserve, and convert the citrus packing house into a museum.</span></span>
Source
Microfilm of original newspaper article: "Farmers' Market Aide Retires." <a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>, September 4, 1968: State Farmers' Market Collection, <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/">Museum of Seminole County History</a>, Sanford, Florida.
Publisher
<a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>
Date Created
ca. 1968-09-04
Is Format Of
Digital reproduction of microfilm copy of newspaper article: "Farmers' Market Aide Retires." <a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>, September 4, 1968.
Is Part Of
<a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>, September 4, 1968.
State Farmers' Market Collection, <a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/">Museum of Seminole County History</a>, Sanford, Florida.
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/omeka2/collections/show/11" target="_blank">Sanford State Farmers' Market Collection</a>, Sanford Collection, Seminole County Collection, RICHES of Central Florida.
Is Referenced By
<a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>, September 4, 1968, page 8A.
Format
image/jpg
Extent
560 KB
Medium
1 newspaper article
Language
eng
Type
Text
Coverage
Sanford State Farmers' Market, Sanford, Florida
Sanford, Florida
Spatial Coverage
28.800733, -81.273112
28.797421, -81.270006
Temporal Coverage
1943-01-01/1968-09-04
Accrual Method
Donation
Mediator
History Teacher
Economics Teacher
Provenance
Originally owned by <a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>.
Rights Holder
Copyright to this resource is held by <em><a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/">The Sanford Herald</a></em> and is provided here by <a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/">RICHES of Central Florida</a> for educational purposes only.
Contributing Project
<a href="http://riches.cah.ucf.edu/buildingblocks.php">Building Blocks</a>
Curator
Cepero, Laura
Digital Collection
<a href="https://richesmi.cah.ucf.edu/map/">RICHES MI</a>
Source Repository
<a href="http://www.seminolecountyfl.gov/departments-services/leisure-services/parks-recreation/museum-of-seminole-county-history/" target="_blank">Museum of Seminole County History</a>
External Reference
Florida. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/1403385" target="_blank"><em>Florida State Farmers Markets:...Annual Report</em></a>. Jacksonville, Fla: Board, 1945-, 1945.
Lewis, L. H. <a href="http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/10264262" target="_blank"><em>Florida State Farmers' Markets</em></a>. Tallahassee, Fla: State of Florida Dept. of Agriculture, 1955. http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00015016.
Sheffield, Glenn. "<a href="http://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=52232" target="_blank">Sanford State Farmers' Market</a>." The Historical Marker Database. http://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=52232.
Transcript
Farmers' Market Aide Retires
First rest and back to work in civic activities and "all the other things I've wanted to do and couldn't over the past many years" are on the agenda for Mrs. Edith M. Dutton, who is retiring after 28 years service as secretary to Leo Butner, manager of the Sanford Farmer's Market.
Mrs. Dutton was recognized for services to agriculture and awarded her 25 year pin three years ago this coming December at the annual statewide conference.
Residing at 213 West 16th Street, she has two daughters, Mrs. Laurelle Inge of Miami and Mrs. June Wilkins of Sanford and three grandchildren, Susan Inge of Miami and Billy and Cynthia Lynn Wilkins of Sanford. Both of Mrs. Dutton's daughters are graduates of Seminole High School and Mrs. Wilkins is a registered nurse and employed at Seminole Memorial Hospital.
Most memorable during Mrs. Dutton's service at the Farmers' Market is when the old building north of the present facility burned to the ground on Apr. 4, 1957. The new building was erected almost immediately and dedicated in October of the same year.
Only two commissioners of agriculture were in office during her long service, Nathan Mayo and the present one, Doyle Connor.
Mrs. Dutton plans in 1970 "Be the Lord willing" to go to Kansas and attend the 50th year alumni celebration at Seneca High School.
EDIT DUTTON
Date Copyrighted
1968-09-04
Date Issued
1968-09-04
Has Format
Original newspaper article: "Farmers' Market Aide Retires." <a href="http://mysanfordherald.com/"><em>The Sanford Herald</em></a>, September 4, 1968.
13th Street
16th Street
Butner, Leo
Connor, Doyle
Dutton, Edith
farmers' market
fire
French Avenue
Ings, Laurelle
Ings, Susan
Mayo, Nathan
retirement
Sanford
Sanford State Farmers' Market
secretary
Seminole Memorial Hospital
Seneca High School
Sixteenth Street
The Sanford Herald
Thirteenth Street
Wilkins, Billy
Wilkins, Cynthia Lynn
Wilkins, June